ASA Baserunning question...

[AMMOVanErt]

Watching an ASA game last night, situation I have never seen before happened, and I just wanted to know if the umpire got the call right.

0 outs, runner on 1st and 2nd. Hard one hopper hit to 2nd baseman. Runner on 2nd base freezes about 3 steps off the bag. SS and 1st baseman turn the double play. However, the runner on second is still about 3 steps off the base. 1st baseman throws back to SS to tag runner, but he beats the throw back to 2nd. Umpire rules 2 outs, runner safe on 2nd and inning continues. Defensive team appealed the call, but umpire said that the runner on second base did not have to advance because the runner going to 2nd base was out, opening 2nd base.

Was this the correct ruling? I thought the runner had to advance to third because the ball was not caught and 1st base was occupied, double play or not.

 

[hookumsnivy]

Absolutely correct.
R1 = Runner on 1st
R2 = Runner on 2nd

Once R1 was ruled out, there is no longer a force on R2.
That's why if there's a runner on 1st and a ball is hit hard to the 1st baseman, if he touches first before the batter-runner and throws to 2nd it becomes a tag play. The force is gone.

 

[AMMOVanErt]

Thanks for the reply. Makes sense when you think of it in the scenario you mentioned. Appreciate the help.

 

[hookumsnivy]

You're welcome.
Just to add to it because it sometimes causes confusion - and it might help someone:
The situation:

Runner on 1st base (R1) and the batter hits a hard one hopper to the 1st baseman (F3).

If R1 stays on the bag you can get the double play by tagging R1, because he's forced to go to 2nd, and then touching 1st base before the batter-runner gets there. If you touch 1st base before tagging R1, you only get 1 out (unless of course R1 steps off 1st base for you to tag him).

 

[JPFreeIV]

Sane type thing happened to me. I was playing third bases loaded, grounder to me. I touch third to get the force on the runner from second, I anticipate having to throw home, but the runner who was on third never moved! I touched bag then tagged runner, but I guess I should have tagged the runner on third then the bag? I was planning on touching third then going home(slow runner on third and would have been an easy out).

Unbelievable the just stayed on third. The ump was clueless anyway so he called the guy on third out and let the 2nd base runner have third. (This ump didnt't call a single infield fly either - there were 3 - he told me bases had to be loaded if no one was out WOW)

 

[hookumsnivy]

Yes, you should have tagged the runner on 3rd before touching the base. You would have gotten the DP. The ump made the wrong call, but at least it didn't change the outcome.