ASA is ASA the same effect as SSUSA

[jonsey]

here is a scenario in senior softball that has a 5 run per inning limit and no hit and sit, runners must advance all awarded bases, bases loaded 1 out, 5th run is on 3rd, batter walks, and all runners advance 1 base except the batter who enters the dugout, the defense appeals that he did not touch 1st and gets the 2nd out and because the batter didn't touch 1st the runners on base were not forced to advance, so they return all the runners, and per the rule below the same result would occur on a single to the outfield.

I cant believe that the runners would have to return ??

this is the SSUSA rule
8.3 • BATTER-RUNNER IS OUT....C. When he fails to advance to first base and enters his team area after a
batted fair ball, a base on balls, or catcher obstruction. EFFECT: The ball
is dead, the batter-runner is out and runners cannot advance.


and here is ASA rule, Section 2. BATTER-RUNNER IS OUT
D. When the batter-runner fails to advance to first base and enters the team area
after a batted fair ball, a base on balls, a hit batter (Fast Pitch), a dropped
third strike, or catcher obstruction.
EXCEPTION: (Slow Pitch) The ball is dead when runners are not required to
run bases on a home run or four base award, or on a base on balls, or (Fast
Pitch) on a hit batter. The batter-runner is not out. Other than on a home run
or a four base award, runners cannot advance unless forced.
































.

 

[NCASAUmp]

The rule is the same in both associations. In USA Softball (formerly ASA), runners are awarded the next base on a base on balls when they are forced to advance. That award does not go away if the batter-runner gets called out for entering the team area in the fast pitch game (since the rule that you quoted states that it doesn't apply to slow pitch).

The SSUSA rule, as written, is almost word-for-word identical to the rule from USA Softball. Even though the batter-runner is called out, the poorly worded rule still awards the other runners the next base.

I agree it's confusing, but that's the interpretation.

And holy crap, do you really need so many lines at the end of your post? Come on, man...

 

[jonsey]

ncasa sorry about that extra space not sure how I did that and as far as SSUSA rule I was told from there home office that the runners would not advance because b/r did not force them to when he entered the dugout it doesn't seem right to me and same penalty for a single and b/r did not touch 1st

 

[jonsey]

ncasa in reading the asa rule again I think this writing is even more confusing, in asa slo-pitch doesn't the b/r have to advance to 1st base on a walk ? because the EXCEPTION says ball is dead when runners are not required to run bases and the end of the
EXCEPTION Other than on a home run or a four base award, runners cannot advance unless forced, what does this mean? aren't they talking about runners that have to advance as in a walk??

EXCEPTION: (Slow Pitch) The ball is dead when runners are not required to
run bases on a home run or four base award, or on a base on balls, or (Fast
Pitch) on a hit batter. The batter-runner is not out. Other than on a home run
or a four base award, runners cannot advance unless forced.

 

[NCASAUmp]

Yes, the batter-runner still has to advance to 1st base on a walk. What they're saying is that if the ball is dead and the batter-runner happens to step into the dugout (for example, to put his bat back in the dugout), it's not an out.

 

[jonsey]

Yes, the batter-runner still has to advance to 1st base on a walk. What they're saying is that if the ball is dead and the batter-runner happens to step into the dugout (for example, to put his bat back in the dugout), it's not an out.

ncasa ok thx I get that scenario of just stepping in the dugout but sometimes they enter dugout thinking inning is over so another question lets say bases loaded 1 out winning run is on 3rd and batter walks but fails to touch 1st and walks off the field and enters parking lot all other runners advance defense now appeals b/r not touching 1st for out #2 since batter did not touch 1st are the other runners forced to advance? thank you for your help

 

[NCASAUmp]

Runners are still forced to advance.

If there had already been two outs prior to this play, then no runs would score on the proper appeal.