New stamp coming? What does this mean?

[jbo911]

Any new complex built should have 325ft fences

The main reason that makes no sense is because of increased cost, but weekday pisses me off is it's all about lowering the bar. They're not going to increase the size of the strike zone of they do that.

They should really dumb down the equipment a lot, like 325 compression a lot, them move the fences in to 285. Leave the bases where they are now. Make it harder to get a hit all the way around. The pretenders will lose 200 points off their averages.

 

[longball101]

The long ball should be just that...long. Any new facility being built isn't going to absorb an enormous cost for putting the fences at 325. If they wanted to save money in the long run they would make there baseball complexes multi-use and artificial turf...longer fences, less long term maintenance, can play many more games etc....

 

[TWmccoy]

Be nice to get to a point again where you actually have to put a good swing on a ball to hit it out. Had a tourney last Saturday. Temps ranged from low 40's to mid 60's as the high. Quickly back into the 50's in the evening. Place was a launching pad. One of the ones I hit had no business being a HR. Doubt it reached 20 feet in the air.

What cor/compression ball were you using? Anything .44 375 or classic M is going to be an absolute rock at those temps.

 

[TWmccoy]

The main reason that makes no sense is because of increased cost, but weekday pisses me off is it's all about lowering the bar. They're not going to increase the size of the strike zone of they do that.

They should really dumb down the equipment a lot, like 325 compression a lot, them move the fences in to 285. Leave the bases where they are now. Make it harder to get a hit all the way around. The pretenders will lose 200 points off their averages.

The deadest Easton composite I have (1 piece Ronin) tests at 325. I still go yard with it regularly, but the bat is definitely stiff.

 

[Redsfan]

What cor/compression ball were you using? Anything .44 375 or classic M is going to be an absolute rock at those temps.

I actually have no clue. I should probably pay more attention but I don't. Had gold dots at one time this year. All I know is they are crap balls when it's 90 and super balls when it is cool/cold.

 

[D-ROCK13]

Sounds like a .40/325 to me

 

[jbo911]

The long ball should be just that...long. Any new facility being built isn't going to absorb an enormous cost for putting the fences at 325. If they wanted to save money in the long run they would make there baseball complexes multi-use and artificial turf...longer fences, less long term maintenance, can play many more games etc....

If everyone's hitting 220 then 300 is a long ball. Nobody is impressed by people hitting 325 with today's equipment anyway. I play with a 5'7" 47 year old that did it twice for outs last year.

The real cost is real estate, not fencing. Every park i can think of here has fields right up to their property lines as is. One had a river behind the fence. No options there.

These guys are hitting the ball plenty far with equipment that would humble 90% of today's players. There is absolutely no reason we can't move closer to this.

 

[longball101]

I remember playing with some blue dots back in the day....absolute rocks...aluminum bats..there were plenty of bombs hit back then too. No matter what is done players will ask for better bats...companies will oblige in the name of the almighty $. In our local leagues when I play with the younger guys there are lots of HR's, there are limits and limits are often not met..UTRIP bats 44/375 balls, HR's are not a big factor wither way. Maybe they up the fence to a 20 footer just for fun

 

[jbo911]

Homeruns aren't the real problem, they're just the easiest stat to look at.

There were plenty of bombs hit back then, with everyone swinging away on every swing practically. Plenty of guys hitting bombs now would be lucky to get one a year if there's a change though.

You're absolutely right about the money, which is why this lies solely on the associations imo. They're supposed to maintain the safety of the players, maintain competitive balance, and be stewards of the game. Little league and other baseball leagues can change their equipment, i just don't understand why utrip acts like they can't change theirs.

 

[Hiltz]

I remember playing with some blue dots back in the day....absolute rocks...aluminum bats..there were plenty of bombs hit back then too. No matter what is done players will ask for better bats...companies will oblige in the name of the almighty $.

At least with the old aluminums you had to be somewhat skilled to consistently hit the sweetspot. Now you have guys taking awful swings and putting balls over the fence with idiot-proof 14" barrels that have a 10" effective hitting area.

Homeruns aren't the real problem, they're just the easiest stat to look at.

The real problems start when the homeruns are gone and the infield becomes a shooting gallery.

 

[jbo911]

The real problems start when the homeruns are gone and the infield becomes a shooting gallery.

For the skilled players. The real problem is at the league level where they hit it almost as hard with no idea where its going. Our influx of new blood is being strangled because they're tired of getting their tits blown off before they even try a tournament.

 

[Redsfan]

In the 3 years I've been back playing I've seen the number of teams in our league drop by 8. The bad teams playing for fun aren't having any fun getting run ruled and drilled by softballs every week. Maybe I never noticed it when I played before but the talent gap seems much wider now between good and bad players than it was in the 90's.

 

[jbo911]

In the 3 years I've been back playing I've seen the number of teams in our league drop by 8. The bad teams playing for fun aren't having any fun getting run ruled and drilled by softballs every week. Maybe I never noticed it when I played before but the talent gap seems much wider now between good and bad players than it was in the 90's.

It's just highlighted the gap that was always there because now a greater number of players hit the ball harder while nothing was done on the other side of the ball. Its like softball is the only sport where people forget there is a defensive side. They definitely forget the first step of defense is pitching that keeps the other team from just teeing off. Well, here we are, practically playing tee ball.

 

[jbo911]

For a side tangent, testing is back at gsl world this year. That is great news, but as is always the case in softball there is some bad news. One parks tester is broken. How long has that been true?

The real kicker to me is a team only gets 20 tests. If your bat fails, that counts against that 20. We haven't had testing in years, and now we're supposed to know what's failing and what's not? I have backups i know are passing, but 20 attempts aren't enough for each of us to have 2. Just a little irritating, but i also know teams will show up with every bat they own to try and find the 10 lowest bats they have that pass.

 

[Redsfan]

It's just highlighted the gap that was always there because now a greater number of players hit the ball harder while nothing was done on the other side of the ball. Its like softball is the only sport where people forget there is a defensive side. They definitely forget the first step of defense is pitching that keeps the other team from just teeing off. Well, here we are, practically playing tee ball.

You are 100% correct about the defense. It would be safe to say 75% of my league is bad at defense. Back in the day we were all ex baseball players. We knew what to do. Now it seems most players never played baseball or if they did they didn't play past little league. No fundamentals and no real idea of what is going on out in the field. Then throw in 100 mph + exit velo's and they are screwed.

 

[longball101]

Same in our local league. What I see is that all the real talent, that can hit AND play defense usually end up on two teams. Then those are the only good games, twice a season, all others are blow outs. People that can still play defense and have a decent arm have no problems with the current state of the game, but there are many that I get a nervous stomach on when I see them even think about trying to play an infield spot

 

[D-ROCK13]

Co-ed gets really scary sometimes here, because all the newb teams, place no experience girls, at 3rd base. And we hit gold dot extremes...

 

[longball101]

That should be against league rules...lol...poor sacrificial lambs

 

[jbo911]

I was playing coed back in the day against a lady pitcher who let a throw back from the catcher tip off her glove and hit her in the forehead. We were all terrified.

 

[rmp0012002]

The rules have just become confusing and have changed multiple times. If the new standard is 240 but 220 bats are grandfathered ( just can’t be made) they still fail anywhere there’s going to be bat testing. Players will be showing up with bats they can’t use. I’ll just wait until next year to buy my USSSA bats.

 

[jbo911]

The rules have just become confusing and have changed multiple times. If the new standard is 240 but 220 bats are grandfathered ( just can’t be made) they still fail anywhere there’s going to be bat testing. Players will be showing up with bats they can’t use. I’ll just wait until next year to buy my USSSA bats.

Exactly the point i made when this news came out about grandfathering. If they have to pad the new 240 standard, i can think of a few brands that won't have many legal bats even niw. These guys stock piling are going to be extra pissed.

Mine passed Friday, but i saw a few while i was in line that looked pretty new that didn't. For all i know those guys cleaned them up to try and get another chance though. At least 75% of guys I've seen have a bat fail since they started testing have said something like they want them to just pass it this one time or something. Come on! That's brand new! It's only got 20 swings on it!

 

[rmp0012002]

Exactly the point i made when this news came out about grandfathering. If they have to pad the new 240 standard, i can think of a few brands that won't have many legal bats even niw. These guys stock piling are going to be extra pissed.

Mine passed Friday, but i saw a few while i was in line that looked pretty new that didn't. For all i know those guys cleaned them up to try and get another chance though. At least 75% of guys I've seen have a bat fail since they started testing have said something like they want them to just pass it this one time or something. Come on! That's brand new! It's only got 20 swings on it!

I don’t know what a NIW bat would test at but would be rather pissed that a bat just out of the wrapper would be tossed. This is more shady and confusing then when they changed the standards for 2013 and nothing was grandfathered.

 

[ShortYellowBus]

Hypothetical scenario aside, most players play in environments where testing is only done if the bat causes harm or perhaps someone is suspected of cheating by an opposition.

The tournament and conference players will be afflicted by the new stamp regulations and most people will not.

So most of the people hoarding NIW bats probably either sell them via raffles or prefer trades, so there’s that problem.

The higher compression number affects far less people than you think.

 

[Hiltz]

If the new standard is 240 but 220 bats are grandfathered ( just can’t be made) they still fail anywhere there’s going to be bat testing. Players will be showing up with bats they can’t use.

My understanding is that grandfathered bats will still be tested at 220 while the new stamp bats will be tested at 240. Which is ridiculous. Guy A could have a new bat fail at 239 while Guy B gets his passed at 221.

This is more shady and confusing then when they changed the standards for 2013 and nothing was grandfathered.

The 2013 change was less shady. It was done because USSSA found out that bats were breaking in and performing way higher than initial testing allowed. So they were banned for safety reasons. Now you have a new certification with new testing standards, but the old bats that exceed those standards are still going to be allowed.

Higher compression number affects far less people than you think.

I've never seen a bat tester in person, and I'm probably in the majority. My bats could be at 275 or they could be at 190 and I'd never know.

 

[EAJuggalo]

DW posted on Old Scout that as far as he has been told anything that is being tested next year has to pass at 240. No idea how that will play out, but that's what has been said.

My understanding is that grandfathered bats will still be tested at 220 while the new stamp bats will be tested at 240. Which is ridiculous. Guy A could have a new bat fail at 239 while Guy B gets his passed at 221.

Above is my post from last Monday. DW is a USSSA contractor who sees more softball in a year that just about anyone else out there. He is in Viera for Worlds along with everyone else who matters and asked the question. He was told, posted on his site and no one has refuted it, that the USSSA standard for next year is 240. Local TD's can make whatever rules they want, including lowering the threshold to pass if they are testing, but I would expect that the majority will follow the lead of CUSSSA and the National Office.

 

[jbo911]

The higher numbers effect everyone, but not all in the same ways or at the same time maybe. We're just speculating, but if you play where they don't test that doesn't mean you're free and clear. No matter what they go with, I'm sure this is cleaning up their legal liabilities if players are injured.

Having two standards like they initially suggested would leave them wide open to lawsuit.

 

[TWmccoy]

At least with the old aluminums you had to be somewhat skilled to consistently hit the sweetspot. Now you have guys taking awful swings and putting balls over the fence with idiot-proof 14" barrels that have a 10" effective hitting area.

The real problems start when the homeruns are gone and the infield becomes a shooting gallery.

This sums it up. Bats really are idiotproof these days. Even a crap swing can launch a ball 350' or more. Part of the problem is the fact that bats break in and the barrels get really soft. That means even someone with no batspeed can still hit HRs with a bat that's acting like a slingshot.

Honestly, I think the best bat/ball combo to make the game "real" again would be singlewall aluminum and .52 300 balls. The good hitters would still hit bombs, but the pretenders would be well short of the warning track.

Bats like Ultimate Weapons and Vexxums actually hit .52s pretty well. The softness of the ball would keep the bats from getting destroyed too.

 

[Hiltz]

Honestly, I think the best bat/ball combo to make the game "real" again would be singlewall aluminum and .52 300 balls. The good hitters would still hit bombs, but the pretenders would be well short of the warning track.

Bats like Ultimate Weapons and Vexxums actually hit .52s pretty well. The softness of the ball would keep the bats from getting destroyed too.

You could go a step further and just say "all aluminums". I haven't noticed a difference between singlewalls and doublewalls when hitting .52's.

Unfortunately, it'll never happen. Like you said, the bats would last forever and no bat manufacturer would want it. And let's face it, bat manufacturers control the game, not the associations.

 

[jbo911]

You could go a step further and just say "all aluminums". I haven't noticed a difference between singlewalls and doublewalls when hitting .52's.

Unfortunately, it'll never happen. Like you said, the bats would last forever and no bat manufacturer would want it. And let's face it, bat manufacturers control the game, not the associations.

Their margins would also be less according to what I've heard. That's a double whammy never going to happen.

I'd be pretty happy with a max 12" barrel and the classic plus, but that's another thing that they don't have the guts to do.

 

[Hiltz]

Their margins would also be less according to what I've heard. That's a double whammy never going to happen.

Aluminum costs a fortune compared to composite materials. There's a place locally that designs and builds composite airplane parts that employs a bunch of guys I know. They say that about 90% of their costs are in engineering, R&D, and final machining. The material costs are insignificant. Now imagine how much actual engineering goes into a softball bat compared to a 737 wing skin...