Pump Fake

S

sleeping bear

Extra Hitter
Quick scenario:

last night the opposing pitcher kept breaking out this pump fake (ASA League ball) it wasn’t all the time but he would pump (about 80% pitch range of motion) glove the pall and then pitch.

We complained a few times and the ump literally ignored it. after the 4th time we started complaining and the ump said "the batter wasn’t ready"

Then I get into the box plant and say "I’m ready blue".

1st pitch a ball short.
then a pump fake which I turn and say "you see that?!?"
followed by a hittable pitch which I singled.

A few batters later (our catcher) new to the game and not great at the bat. I’m on 3rd and he gets pump faked and then struck out. (I know, I know..)

On my way in I tell the blue that either he calls it fair and gives out pitcher full USSSA fake allowance or he puts a stop to this immediately.

ONLY then did he turn to their dugout and address with their pitcher.

my question is this:

What is the penalty for a USSSA fake pitch in ASA ball? is it basically a Balk?
 
L

lindino08

Extra Hitter
I don't even understand why any pitcher would do a fake pitch and really how a batter could be affected by it. It's not like baseball where for the most part your starting your load right before the ball is pitched. It's slow pitch you have a good three whole seconds the ball is in the air. You have plenty of time to react. you really don't load until the ball is at the peak. I do understand though that it would be very annoying. It should be illegal due to the fact that it makes the pitcher look ridiculous and just slows the game down.
 
Frisco Kid

Frisco Kid

Addicted to Metal
danielmo said:
does the pump fake do anything other than look stupid? d oes anyone actually get faked out?
Click to expand...

sleeping bear said:
Quick scenario:

last night the opposing pitcher kept breaking out this pump fake (ASA League ball) it wasn’t all the time but he would pump (about 80% pitch range of motion) glove the pall and then pitch.

We complained a few times and the ump literally ignored it. after the 4th time we started complaining and the ump said "the batter wasn’t ready"

Then I get into the box plant and say "I’m ready blue".

1st pitch a ball short.
then a pump fake which I turn and say "you see that?!?"
followed by a hittable pitch which I singled.

A few batters later (our catcher) new to the game and not great at the bat. I’m on 3rd and he gets pump faked and then struck out. (I know, I know..)

On my way in I tell the blue that either he calls it fair and gives out pitcher full USSSA fake allowance or he puts a stop to this immediately.

ONLY then did he turn to their dugout and address with their pitcher.

my question is this:

What is the penalty for a USSSA fake pitch in ASA ball? is it basically a Balk?
Click to expand...

Apparently, yes.
 
krunchyfrogg

krunchyfrogg

It's all in the reflexes
I believe ASA rules dictate the pitcher can't make any motions to decieve the batter with the ball (or something like that). If a pump-fake messes with your timing, as silly as it sounds, it should be an illegal pitch.
 
NCASAUmp

NCASAUmp

Un-Retired
krunchyfrogg said:
I believe ASA rules dictate the pitcher can't make any motions to decieve the batter with the ball (or something like that). If a pump-fake messes with your timing, as silly as it sounds, it should be an illegal pitch.
Click to expand...

No such wording. Once the pitcher has begun the pitch, there can be no stop or reversal of the pitching motion.

Translation: no pump fake or stops in the motion.
 
S

sleeping bear

Extra Hitter
Frisco Kid said:
I'm sure these were all contributing factors, but I'm guessing the pump fakes certainly didn't help. :p
Click to expand...

Exactly. He's an athletic guy but never played baseball or softball and is learning. Has he struck out without "help" from an illegal pitch sure but we are playing E ball and that's where you learn.

My problem is that this guy wasn't mashing the ball so why break the rules to mess with him? He didnt swing at the pump fake obviously it just screwed with his head and contributed to him missing the followup quick pitch.

And thanks for the answers I now know that it's a automatic ball.

We did win both games so I'm not all riled up over it I was just looking for a rule clarification.
 
Hebrew Hacker

Hebrew Hacker

Derby Jew
lindino08 said:
I don't even understand why any pitcher would do a fake pitch and really how a batter could be affected by it. It's not like baseball where for the most part your starting your load right before the ball is pitched. It's slow pitch you have a good three whole seconds the ball is in the air. You have plenty of time to react. you really don't load until the ball is at the peak. I do understand though that it would be very annoying. It should be illegal due to the fact that it makes the pitcher look ridiculous and just slows the game down.
Click to expand...

Not all pump fakes are created equal. There are guys with VERY deceiving motions, who will continue to fake after releasing the ball.
 
pineapple

pineapple

Active Member
A ball shall be called rule 6 sec 3 c..
so if there is a pump fake you should not swing...
no where does it say to call illegal.
 
NCASAUmp

NCASAUmp

Un-Retired
pineapple said:
A ball shall be called rule 6 sec 3 c..
so if there is a pump fake you should not swing...
no where does it say to call illegal.
Click to expand...

That's why you should leave the umpiring to us. :p

EFFECT - Sections 2-4, 7:
A. Any infraction of Sections 2-4, 7 is an illegal pitch.
B. If a batter swings at or contacts any illegal pitch, it is nullified and all play stands.
C. If the batter does not swing, a ball shall be called on the batter.
Click to expand...
 
T

TEX1959

Addicted to Softballfans
Theres a pitcher where I play ASA that does that fake crap all the time and the umps dont have enuf sense to call it.
Several years ago, team I was with was playing his team and he was doing that crap, told my teammates, rather loudly, not to pay any attention to that stuff, just hit the ball. So, when I come up to bat he does it for what seemed like 10 to 15 seconds or more, I finally stepped out of the batters box, and then he pitches. Umpire calls a strike. The next pitch went right back by him.
He didnt do it anymore the rest of the game.
 
Last edited:
I

irishmafia

Addicted to Softballfans
TEX1959 said:
Theres a pitcher where I play ASA that does that fake crap all the time and the umps dont have enuf sense to call it.
Several years ago, team I was with was playing his team and he was doing that crap, told my teammates, rather loudly, not to pay any attention to that stuff, just hit the ball. So, when I come up to bat he does it for what seemed like 10 to 15 seconds or more, I finally stepped out of the batters box, and then he pitches. Umpire calls a strike. The next pitch went right back by him.
He didnt do it anymore the rest of the game.
Click to expand...

What was the result of the protests?
 
spartanmikek

spartanmikek

Addicted to Softballfans
irishmafia said:
That is wrong.

6SP.3.A and EFFECT at the bottom of page 72 states it is an IP
Click to expand...

If you read closely what pine wrote he said "no where does it state to CALL it an illegal pitch (he obviously is referring to before it crosses the plate)". So he's not saying the pitch isnt illegal he's saying the umpire doesn't have to announce it illegal to the batter if I'm reading his quote correctly. Who knows though I've been wrong many times before lol
 
spartanmikek

spartanmikek

Addicted to Softballfans
danielmo said:
does the pump fake do anything other than look stupid? d oes anyone actually get faked out?
Click to expand...

Like hebrew mentioned their are guys that do it extremely well and release the ball at all different times in their fake. To me it seems like this does have the most effect on guys who walk the box when they hit, it does throw their timing a bit imo.
 
NCASAUmp

NCASAUmp

Un-Retired
spartanmikek said:
If you read closely what pine wrote he said "no where does it state to CALL it an illegal pitch (he obviously is referring to before it crosses the plate)". So he's not saying the pitch isnt illegal he's saying the umpire doesn't have to announce it illegal to the batter if I'm reading his quote correctly. Who knows though I've been wrong many times before lol
Click to expand...

Nowhere does it say that I have to announce that a runner is out when they're tagged. It just says they're out.

I'll state it again, leave the umpiring to us, guys. ;)
 
T

TEX1959

Addicted to Softballfans
irishmafia said:
What was the result of the protests?
Click to expand...

LOL, that was back when I was young and dumber, had no idea it was illegal.
Was watching games on different night than what I play a couple weeks back.
Saw the pitcher doing it, pitching pretty much UTrip style, then realized it was him when guy I was talking with called his name. And the ump never said a word to him about it.
 
Pumacat35

Pumacat35

Professional Hitter
Hebrew Hacker said:
Not all pump fakes are created equal. There are guys with VERY deceiving motions, who will continue to fake after releasing the ball.
Click to expand...

There are some VERY GOOD Usssa pitchers out there that can get hitters off balance with a good pump fake! It is a little easier to do in USSSA when the ball basically has to arch 3ft from release so it can be thrown faster and harder. We play a few tournies a month in the Seattle area and there is never a speed limit over there on pitches.

We play league in E. Wash and I had a pitch called flat I was shocked and then I remembeered that the Cascade Mts are a huge divide in the USSSA strike zone in Washington
 
Slimer39

Slimer39

Coach
sleeping bear said:
Quick scenario:

last night the opposing pitcher kept breaking out this pump fake (ASA League ball) it wasn’t all the time but he would pump (about 80% pitch range of motion) glove the pall and then pitch.

We complained a few times and the ump literally ignored it. after the 4th time we started complaining and the ump said "the batter wasn’t ready"

Then I get into the box plant and say "I’m ready blue".

1st pitch a ball short.
then a pump fake which I turn and say "you see that?!?"
followed by a hittable pitch which I singled.

A few batters later (our catcher) new to the game and not great at the bat. I’m on 3rd and he gets pump faked and then struck out. (I know, I know..)

On my way in I tell the blue that either he calls it fair and gives out pitcher full USSSA fake allowance or he puts a stop to this immediately.

ONLY then did he turn to their dugout and address with their pitcher.

my question is this:

What is the penalty for a USSSA fake pitch in ASA ball? is it basically a Balk?
Click to expand...



Just buzz his tower and let him know its not a Utrip after you do a bat flip and skip to first.
 
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