Bunt/chop question

[Iceman6409]

First and foremost I am totally aware as an umpire that bunting and intentionally chopping a ball are illegal plays and are automatic outs. I get that. So here is the play from last night. Player at the plate is a real good ball player but literally cannot shut up ever and pretty much argues every single play and most pitches. He has been banned from more leagues than I can count and he knows exactly how far to push an umpire and NOT get tossed. He is at bat. He has been real irritable to me all game. He settles in way up in the batters box which is not his normal stance. Pitch comes in and he starts to lean towards first, left handed batter, just like Ichiro used to do. I looked but felt he stayed within the box. He takes about a 3/4 LEVEL swing and literally lightly tops the ball which dies a few feet in front of home. Catcher never made a play on it.

In my mind, and more so because I could hear him laughing AND talking about it on first, he did this on purpose. He has only swung for the fences on every pitch he ever swung at since I have seen him play. I wanted to call him on a chopped ball but to be perfectly honest his swing was level. But I am 100% sure he did this on purpose because he tried it again later but that time the pitcher came in and fielded the ball and threw him out at first.

CLEARLY not a bunt nor a typical "chop". Is there any call I could have made or is his move legal? I tend to think in the term of the rule book it is legal. If it is so be it. Thoughts?

 

[Joker]

you sound like you just want to call this guy out for any reason. you should stop umpiring if you want to call someone out cause your feelings got hurt

 

[Stretch19]

in what association is a chopped ball illegal?

and how does he know exactly how far to push an umpire and not get tossed, yet he has been banned from more leagues than you can count?

how many ****ing leagues are in your area if this guy has been banned from that many, yet is still playing?

 

[Country469]

the rule says intentionally chopping the ball to deaden it into the ground. Does not sound like that. Nothing in the rule book about intentionally hitting it softly tho, thats called a judy.

 

[Hiltz]

Player at the plate is a real good ball player but literally cannot shut up ever and pretty much argues every single play and most pitches. He has been banned from more leagues than I can count and he knows exactly how far to push an umpire and NOT get tossed.

He has been real irritable to me all game.

In my mind, and more so because I could hear him laughing AND talking about it on first, he did this on purpose.

Thoughts?

I think buddy's got you shook.

 

[kvander]

Agree with Joker here. You're talking about how he normally stand and normally swings. That's irrelevant.

 

[Committed]

Ignore the guy and hope your catcher makes the play going forward. Unless your playing for money, I would try to focus on having a good time.

 

[Stretch19]

Ignore the guy and hope your catcher makes the play going forward. Unless your playing for money, I would try to focus on having a good time.

hes was the umpire, he wasnt playing

 

[ichiromoco]

Do you even comprehend how difficult it is to swing even 3/4 and make just enough contact to miss-hit it perfectly??? Seriously.

 

[Committed]

Gotcha! My reading comprehension is pretty piss poor so I took it as he is a player and also umps.

 

[FatBoy28]

CLEARLY not a bunt nor a typical "chop". Is there any call I could have made or is his move legal? I tend to think in the term of the rule book it is legal. If it is so be it. Thoughts?

You didn’t specify the association so I went with USSSA since it’s the only Rulebook I have handy:

BUNT refers to a batted ball that is intentionally met with the bat and tapped slowly
CHOPPED BALL is a batted ball that the batter strikes downward so that it hits the ground within the infield, with a deliberate attempt and downward chopping motion with the bat.

“He takes about a 3/4 LEVEL swing and literally lightly tops the ball which dies a few feet in front of home.”

Sounds like you could try to justify a bunt call if you really wanted to. Nothing in the definition states that a ¾ swing can’t be a bunt, only that you intend to contact the ball and intend for the ball to “tapped slowly”. In my mind those are judgement calls.

 

[Joker]

You didn’t specify the association so I went with USSSA since it’s the only Rulebook I have handy:

BUNT refers to a batted ball that is intentionally met with the bat and tapped slowly
CHOPPED BALL is a batted ball that the batter strikes downward so that it hits the ground within the infield, with a deliberate attempt and downward chopping motion with the bat.



Sounds like you could have justified a bunt call if you really wanted to. Nothing in the definition states that a ¾ swing can’t be a bunt, only that you intend to contact the ball and intend for the ball to “tapped slowly”. In my mind those are judgement calls.

if you call a bunt on a 3/4 swing, **** you

 

[FatBoy28]

if you call a bunt on a 3/4 swing, **** you

I never said I would, only that the definition does not require anything of the swing itself to be a bunt.

And by the way, the "3/4 swing" is the guestimation of the umpire. How do you know its not a half swing? Would you call a bunt on a half swing?

 

[Joker]

I never said I would, only that the definition does not require anything of the swing itself to be a bunt. And by the way, the "3/4 swing" is the guestimation of the umpire. How do you know its not a half swing? Would you call a bunt on a half swing?

stop, just ****ing stop

 

[FatBoy28]

stop, just ****ing stop

I'll stop if you do

 

[Joker]

this whole thread is a a bad ump whining about a player he doesn't like. you're just trying to throw gas on the fire. **** off

 

[FatBoy28]

this whole thread is a a bad ump whining about a player he doesn't like. you're just trying to throw gas on the fire. **** off

All I did was quote a rule and you curse at people ... who exactly is the one throwing gas?

 

[Joker]

you are by posting **** that is wrong in a thread that shouldn't even exist

 

[FatBoy28]

you are by posting **** that is wrong in a thread that shouldn't even exist

I copied and pasted definitions directly from the rule book. What exactly is wrong?

 

[Joker]

Sounds like you could have justified a bunt call if you really wanted to. Nothing in the definition states that a ¾ swing can’t be a bunt, only that you intend to contact the ball and intend for the ball to “tapped slowly”. In my mind those are judgement calls.

****ing wrong

 

[FatBoy28]

****ing wrong

Do you always try and protest judgement calls?

 

[FatBoy28]

Sounds like you could try to justify a bunt call

Edited for Joker's approval

 

[Joker]

its not a judgement call. a 1/3, 1/2, 3/4, 7/8th swing will never result in the ball being intentionally met with the bat. the bat must be stationary for that to happen. i would win that protest cause you are ****ing wrong. i hope you never ump

 

[FatBoy28]

its not a judgement call. a 1/3, 1/2, 3/4, 7/8th swing will never result in the ball being intentionally met with the bat. the bat must be stationary for that to happen. i would win that protest cause you are ****ing wrong. i hope you never ump

So the only time the ball is "intentionally met with the bat" is a bunt? Every single hit in all of softball is an accident?

 

[Joker]

how ****ing dumb are you?

 

[Joker]

you are so ****ing wrong you can't even understand how ****ing wrong you are.

 

[FatBoy28]

you are so ****ing wrong you can't even understand how ****ing wrong you are.

I'm not the one who said that the bat has to be stationary for the ball to be intentionally met with the bat.

 

[Joker]

BUNT refers to a batted ball that is intentionally met with the bat and tapped slowly

if you take a swing you are bringing the bat to the ball. the bat is meeting the ball
if you keep the bat stationary when contact is made then the ball is coming to the bat. the ball is meeting the bat

first one is legal, the second is a bunt based on the rule you quoted

shut the **** up

 

[FatBoy28]

if you take a swing you are bringing the bat to the ball. the bat is meeting the ball

When the bat is meeting the ball, then the ball has been met with the bat. You may or may not recognize these nuances of the English language from the SATs.

Therefore by your statement a swing can meet the rulebook definition of a bunt

 

[Joker]

there are 2 options here

1. you have never seen a baseball game and have no concept of what a bunt is
2. you have a learning disability and require adult supervision

pretty sure it's option 2. so to the grown up looking over his shoulder, that's enough internet for today