Knob Cuffs Legal ?

[MarlSrSoftball]

Am I reading the ASA rule 3 Section 1 D Safety Grip, that Knob Cuffs are legal as long as they are taped over? We are having a disagreement with a local tournament of knob Cuffs/GripNRips.

 

[beernbombs]

Attached with grip tape. As long as it is secure, It doesn't have to be completely taped over.

 

[NCASAUmp]

Attached with grip tape. As long as it is secure, It doesn't have to be completely taped over.

Yep, this.

 

[MarlSrSoftball]

One of our players emailed the TD with the rule on knob cuffs and this is the ridicules answer he got.

"Joe, you have to get a life. I have no idea what a knob cuff is.

We've published the rule and all the teams have it. We will stay with the language as published in our guidelines."

He is banning something that he has no idea what it is.

 

[eddieq]

Local rules are made by fools. But it's his tournament and if he's banning them, then you can't use them no matter what the championship rules state.

 

[MarlSrSoftball]

I agree. The only thing we are complaining about is that he is banning them because ASA does and this is an ASA tournament and we are just showing him that they are not banned by ASA.

 

[AH23]

Use it until someone tells you to take it off.....and have your ASA book handy for the tourney director.....

 

[COKEMAN]

Is he banning tape too? You could make a taper with layers of tape and see what he does. Or just completely tape over your cuff and tell him it is layers of tape. Or since he doesn't know what a knob cuff is, just tell him, "nah, that's not a knob cuff, that's a conical grip enhancer. I have no idea what a knob cuff is."

 

[NCASAUmp]

Time to email the association's commissioner.

 

[MarlSrSoftball]

Will see him tomorrow at the tournament and he will hear about it.

 

[MarlSrSoftball]

It ended up that it depended on what field you played on and who the ump was. Games that where umped by league officials it was enforced, games umped by league regular umps it was not.

 

[vlcmstnaz]

Who has the rule? Curious what the actual wording is (what defines "attached").

Edit: found it ( I think)
"The safety grip may be a molded finger formed grip as long as it is permanently attached to the bat, or attached with safety tape."

So what does "permanently attached" mean? If it requires a butter knife or super finger strength to remove a GnR knob cuff (without being taped or otherwise secured), is that not sufficiently attached? No tape or grip is truly permanent if you can peel it off/unravel it. To me a GnR is just as "permanent" as a traditional grip.

 

[MarlSrSoftball]

Who has the rule? Curious what the actual wording is (what defines "attached").

"The OFFICIAL BAT shall meet all the requirements of ASA Rule 3. Section 1. – the highlights of the rule are summarized below: The Official Bat shall be no more than 34 inches long nor exceed 38 ounces in weight. It shall be free of burs, dents, cracks, sharp edges and audible rattles and show no signs of excessive wear. The official bat shall not be more than 2.250 inches in diameter at its largest part. The official bat shall be smooth and round to 0.050 inches in diameter and must bear either the ASA 2000 Certification Mark, the ASA 2004 Certification Mark or the new 2013 ASA Softball certification mark for Slow Pitch and must not be listed on the ASA Non-Approved Bat List. The safety knob will be permanently attached to the bat and may be covered with grip tape. It shall have a diameter of at least 1.6 inches with no sharp edges. The bat handle will include a grip. The handle region of the bat must have a grip made of cork, grip tape or other synthetic material and must be permanently attached to the bat. No bare metal, wood or composite material may be exposed in the handle region. The grip shall not be less than 6 inches and not more than 15 inches. Any attachment such as a molded finger grip, flare cone, or choke up device must be attached with grip tape. Resin, pine tar or spray substances are permissible on the grip region only."

 

[vlcmstnaz]

^^^must be a newer version than the 2010 update I found (or was it 2009?).

 

[MarlSrSoftball]

^^^must be a newer version than the 2010 update I found (or was it 2009?).

This was from 2011. I think that is when they changed it to make them legal.

 

[NCASAUmp]

Attachments are permissible if they are attached with grip tape. We don't need to see you wind the whole roll around it, it just needs to look and feel secure enough. Typically, this means just one good ring around the attachment, securing it to the handle. Nothing more.

 

[cmo27]

At ASA Nationals not a single Grip N Rip or Knob cuff was required to have any tape on it. I had 4 bats with me that were never scrutinized for that reason as well as several other teammates.

 

[Hiltz]

So what does "permanently attached" mean? If it requires a butter knife or super finger strength to remove a GnR knob cuff (without being taped or otherwise secured), is that not sufficiently attached? No tape or grip is truly permanent if you can peel it off/unravel it. To me a GnR is just as "permanent" as a traditional grip.

Knobcuffs and GNR's are an absolute pain to remove, I've never heard of one slipping off accidentally. I don't think the rule was written with those tapers in mind. It's probably just a catch-all phrase to prevent some doofus from doing something stupid.

ie: I knew a guy that had multiple bats and one Knobcuff, he slit the side of it so he could pop it on whatever bat he wanted to use. He was a doofus.

At ASA Nationals not a single Grip N Rip or Knob cuff was required to have any tape on it. I had 4 bats with me that were never scrutinized for that reason as well as several other teammates.

You were lucky you had lazy umpires. Just make sure you have a roll of tape on hand for the day you get a stickler.

The grip shall not be less than 6 inches and not more than 15 inches.

I've seen some morons with Lizard Skins applied right up the taper that should need to see this rule.

 

[ELSoftballClub]

At ASA Nationals not a single Grip N Rip or Knob cuff was required to have any tape on it. I had 4 bats with me that were never scrutinized for that reason as well as several other teammates.

Our experience at the ASA regional in Salem was a little different. If the knob cuff was 1 piece and applied by rolling it over the knob, it was fine if it wasnt moving But if it was moving or of the old 2 piece design that snaps together, they were requiring at least some amount of tape over the seem between the 2 pieces. I hadnt seen anything but the usual 1 piece grip n rips in years, but at nationals I did see some people still using the 2 piece snap together knob cuffs.

 

[Hiltz]

Our experience at the ASA regional in Salem was a little different. If the knob cuff was 1 piece and applied by rolling it over the knob, it was fine if it wasnt moving But if it was moving or of the old 2 piece design that snaps together, they were requiring at least some amount of tape over the seem between the 2 pieces. I hadnt seen anything but the usual 1 piece grip n rips in years, but at nationals I did see some people still using the 2 piece snap together knob cuffs.

Are you talking about Grip 'n' Rip Lites? People were using them on top of their grips?