Let's talk modern Utrip Bats.... (golfers welcome)

[THESHOE]

Started this on another Canuck board, wanna see what is said here...

So I am fairly new to the sport by "Slowpitch" standards.

Played hardball and fastpitch as a kid before I gave up for the Lacrosse trend in my late teens.

As an avid golfer, I am slowly finding the ball swing. And as I dabble with bats, I can't help but notice something.

Am I wrong that with this utrip thumbstamp we mostly all have to abide by now, it is exactly like the max COR rules of golf metal woods?

As the tech grows in both sports, I see cool paint, gadgets being added, and growing forgiveness and durability.... But when it comes to the hits right off the screws, no one is gaining miraculous distance...

I've hit all the major bats amongst what my friends have. Some do pop with less break in than others, some don't last very long, others last a lifetime.

But what seems to be common year in and out is they get better in terms of sweet spot and forgiveness. But none are coming out spitting 50+ feet ahead of the next.

Am I wrong?

Just feel like we are almost at the "Taylormade" stage, where each year it will be a paint colour and a small added gadget that will be the selling feature. Why? Because the tech and it's performance are maxed out and regulated. They can only weight and improve them for forgiveness on mi****s, but the ones off the screws will be the same.

Now mind you, I am noticing a lot of people moving to 2pc tech.

My GF loves her Z3K, but to me it has almost a little too much flex to it. So I stuck with L1 and Z2K. Did like the DC41, but not sure it wowed me over what I have enough to dabble (yet).

I can see where manufacturers are searching to improve. But is it just me or is nothing really ever going to be beat that webbed up well worked in high hit count bat?

 

[Malaboo27]

I have a pretty similar background as you and that's my understanding as well. Maybe one of the guys on here with more experience can chime in.

 

[ddoubler]

Technology of bats are as good as its going to get for a while...in fact its been too good in the past they had to ban bats and make them "senior" bats. Due to regulated standards no one company is going to have a superior bat than they other. Tweaks such as 2 piece designs, 3 piece designs, end loads, mid loads, max loads and barrel length are about as good as they can do each year.

 

[The BP Hero]

Because those sanction stamps hold performance to a certain standard. That's why you don't see bats getting hotter and hotter every year.

 

[The BP Hero]

Technology of bats are as good as its going to get for a while...in fact its been too good in the past they had to ban bats and make them "senior" bats. Due to regulated standards no one company is going to have a superior bat than they other. Tweaks such as 2 piece designs, 3 piece designs, end loads, mid loads, max loads and barrel length are about as good as they can do each year.

Yup.


/thread.

 

[THESHOE]

So basically just like the USGA max on COR off the metal faces of the metalwoods in golf. Gotcha.

It got out of hand in golf too, so they maxed the size and rebound effect eventually.

Ever since all you get is easier to hit off center, but off the screws nothing miraculous.

They've gone lighter to increase swing speed, but you can only take that so far.

Because those sanction stamps hold performance to a certain standard. That's why you don't see bats getting hotter and hotter every year.

 

[Joker]

Because those sanction stamps hold performance to a certain standard. That's why you don't see bats getting hotter and hotter every year.

 

[The BP Hero]

 

[oilslick58]

First and foremost...the new Stamp thingy is from greedy m**** F*****s

The only thing I see that you are wrong is the statement about some lasting a Lifetime. Lets just say.......3 or 4 are solid. The rest opted for the, Hot quickly, then go booom, option

 

[THESHOE]

Read that line again, I specifically said some don't last very long while others last a lifetime. Lifetime might not be the right term, but I have yet to see anyone break certain models.

I spoke with experience based on a Z2k RI vs a Blackout or Easton.

I don't mind the hot quickly. The older I get the less I have time to BP and lay the hits needed for these to be G2G.

First and foremost...the new Stamp thingy is from greedy m**** F*****s

The only thing I see that you are wrong is the statement about some lasting a Lifetime. Lets just say.......3 or 4 are solid. The rest opted for the, Hot quickly, then go booom, option

 

[oilslick58]

Read that line again, I specifically said some don't last very long while others last a lifetime.

I spoke with experience based on a Z2k RI vs a Blackout or Easton.

I don't mind the hot quickly. The older I get the less I have time to BP and lay the hits needed for these to be G2G.

I read your line correctly........... and its funny that you name one bat....then name one company. You know, not every Easton made is a Syn2 as in lifespan, right. That is a generalization that you just can't make.
That being said.........its just semantix. Ignore me and go on as you were.

 

[oilslick58]

I don't mind the hot quickly. The older I get the less I have time to BP and lay the hits needed for these to be G2G.[

We as softball consumers asked for this. We all should be happy with the hotness:bigok:

 

[ball go far]

i is happy with hotness

 

[2TransAms]

Because those sanction stamps hold performance to a certain standard. That's why you don't see bats getting hotter and hotter every year.

Let this be the end of the matter.

 

[jhitman]

Started this on another Canuck board, wanna see what is said here...

So I am fairly new to the sport by "Slowpitch" standards.

Played hardball and fastpitch as a kid before I gave up for the Lacrosse trend in my late teens.

As an avid golfer, I am slowly finding the ball swing. And as I dabble with bats, I can't help but notice something.

Am I wrong that with this utrip thumbstamp we mostly all have to abide by now, it is exactly like the max COR rules of golf metal woods?

As the tech grows in both sports, I see cool paint, gadgets being added, and growing forgiveness and durability.... But when it comes to the hits right off the screws, no one is gaining miraculous distance...

I've hit all the major bats amongst what my friends have. Some do pop with less break in than others, some don't last very long, others last a lifetime.

But what seems to be common year in and out is they get better in terms of sweet spot and forgiveness. But none are coming out spitting 50+ feet ahead of the next.

Am I wrong?

Just feel like we are almost at the "Taylormade" stage, where each year it will be a paint colour and a small added gadget that will be the selling feature. Why? Because the tech and it's performance are maxed out and regulated. They can only weight and improve them for forgiveness on mi****s, but the ones off the screws will be the same.

Now mind you, I am noticing a lot of people moving to 2pc tech.

My GF loves her Z3K, but to me it has almost a little too much flex to it. So I stuck with L1 and Z2K. Did like the DC41, but not sure it wowed me over what I have enough to dabble (yet).

I can see where manufacturers are searching to improve. But is it just me or is nothing really ever going to be beat that webbed up well worked in high hit count bat?

I have played both sports for many years. The technology in golf continues to improve year after year. When I first started golf I could hit a WOODEN driver about 250 yards. I'm 25 years older now and can hit the new technology clubs 50 yards further and I'm not as strong as I use to be.

Softball bats were going in the same direction. In the early 2000's, I believe we were at the pinnacle. We were using 47, 48 & 50 cor 525 compression softballs. We also had the use of Ultra's and the composite bats were just coming into play taking over from the old metal bats. Everyone was hitting HR's and people were getting hurt because of the trampoline affect off the new technology bats. The governing bodies saw this and have been cutting us back for years now. We are using decent bats now, but nothing like the old Ultras. And our softballs are 52 cor 300 comp. A far cry from what he had 10 years ago.

So from my perspective golf continues to improve technology and people are hitting the ball as far as ever. Softball is regressing and dummying down the softballs and equipment for safety reasons. So your assumption that any webbed up well broken in bat will be just as good as any other is pretty right on.

 

[Dogue]

Let me be the one to state the obvious, especially since the OP is relatively new to this sport; yes, most high end bats are very similar in performance. Some are more forgiving, some have better feel (individual taste) some will have a larger sweetspot, etc, but the differences are slight. BUT, that doesn't mean a $75 bat at your favorite retailer is the same as a $200-300 bat just because they have the same stamp.

I only bring this up because I overheard a conversation at the fields last weekend where one guy was explaining how his "new stamp" aluminum Easton was as hot as "any of those other new stamp bats."

 

[THESHOE]

Thanks for chiming in.

No I understand that it's composite $200-$350 range bats that are on par.

It's like arguing a no name Walmart driver is on par with the Taylormade stuff. No freaking way.

I'm new, but not THAT new :thumb:

Let me be the one to state the obvious, especially since the OP is relatively new to this sport; yes, most high end bats are very similar in performance. Some are more forgiving, some have better feel (individual taste) some will have a larger sweetspot, etc, but the differences are slight. BUT, that doesn't mean a $75 bat at your favorite retailer is the same as a $200-300 bat just because they have the same stamp.

I only bring this up because I overheard a conversation at the fields last weekend where one guy was explaining how his "new stamp" aluminum Easton was as hot as "any of those other new stamp bats."

 

[THESHOE]

Well said. In golf the shafts are getting better in terms of fitting individual players.

We may see a day where a player buys a handle and a barrel to piece together and call it a bat, for optimal fit at max exit speed allowed...

I think in golf, and the day is coming, the only factor left is the ball. They keep getting better and better as well as some slight elements like weight placement to reduce or increase spin ratios. Soon there will be a tournament spec ball I think.

Slow pitch has done a good job of adjusting the ball to keep the equipment relative to the sport and it's playing field IMHO.

Seems like my thoughts are on par with the vets. A lot of it year in and out is hype, not raw data and miraculous 50ft increases.

I have played both sports for many years. The technology in golf continues to improve year after year. When I first started golf I could hit a WOODEN driver about 250 yards. I'm 25 years older now and can hit the new technology clubs 50 yards further and I'm not as strong as I use to be.

Softball bats were going in the same direction. In the early 2000's, I believe we were at the pinnacle. We were using 47, 48 & 50 cor 525 compression softballs. We also had the use of Ultra's and the composite bats were just coming into play taking over from the old metal bats. Everyone was hitting HR's and people were getting hurt because of the trampoline affect off the new technology bats. The governing bodies saw this and have been cutting us back for years now. We are using decent bats now, but nothing like the old Ultras. And are softballs are 52 cor 300 comp. A far cry from what he had 10 years ago.

So from my perspective golf continues to improve technology and people are hitting the ball as far as ever. Softball is regressing and dummying down the softballs and equipment for safety reasons. So your assumption that any webbed up well broken in bat will be just as good as any other is pretty right on.

 

[Laoch]

Because those sanction stamps hold performance to a certain standard. That's why you don't see bats getting hotter and hotter every year.

And when people say bats feel better each year that tells me that the previous year wasn't as close to the sanction limits as we were meant to believe.

 

[pontiacfb78]

Its all a combination of safety (like the new 52 core balls) and limiting the ultimate distance. Granted, you can hand some guys a pine 2x4 with a handle and they can hit a 300ft bomb, but if you let anyone hit with the hottest bats that the manufacturers could muster, softball would turn into a HR derby.

 

[chrometip78]

Blah blah blah I just wanted to hear myself talk too, LSX said what needed to be said short and sweet style.

 

[oilslick58]

Blah......................

 

[2TransAms]

And when people say bats feel better each year that tells me that the previous year wasn't as close to the sanction limits as we were meant to believe.

It tells me people convince themselves that a new paint job is a newer, better bat.

I'm not saying they don't tweak them every year, I don't really know. But no manufacturer is going to intentionally put out a bat that underperforms.

 

[chrometip78]

Blah......................

Good point, actually hadn't thought of that, thank you for sharing. Next please.

 

[jhitman]

Well said. In golf the shafts are getting better in terms of fitting individual players.

We may see a day where a player buys a handle and a barrel to piece together and call it a bat, for optimal fit at max exit speed allowed...

I think in golf, and the day is coming, the only factor left is the ball. They keep getting better and better as well as some slight elements like weight placement to reduce or increase spin ratios. Soon there will be a tournament spec ball I think.

Slow pitch has done a good job of adjusting the ball to keep the equipment relative to the sport and it's playing field IMHO.

Seems like my thoughts are on par with the vets. A lot of it year in and out is hype, not raw data and miraculous 50ft increases.

I agree it's mostly hype. I do agree that a high end bat will completely outperform a Walmart $20.00 special though. Unless the powers that be decide to go back to the better softballs and technology of an Ultra, Lady Virus etc. we will be stuck with the middle of the road standards that exist now. Then the bat purchase is simplified, any high end bat, personal preference and breaking the bat in.

 

[GOING 4 THIRD]

not bad for 13 posts. not bad.