New asa bat standards - some answers from asa

[SeanSic]

Here ya guys go... NOT ALL THE ANSWERS, but some.

ASA Bat Performance Standard for 2013
10/12/2012



SLOW PITCH for 2013 and BEYOND in ASA

There WILL be changes for Certification Mark and Test Standard for all bats used in the game of ASA Slow Pitch Softball for the 2013 season.

There will be a new Certification Mark to be used on future bat models manufactured for the game of Slow Pitch for 2013 and beyond. The current 2000 and 2004 Certification Marks will continue to be valid Marks for the existing Slow Pitch bats.

Any new models produced by the manufacturers will display the new Certification Mark for bats used in the game of Slow Pitch Softball for ASA.

The new certification mark will look like this image below (ASA Shield):All bats currently listed on the approved bat lists will remain legal for ASA; ASA will continue to perform random testing of all approved models to verify conformance of the approved bat performance standard, any model found out of compliance could be added to the non-approved list. All models currently listed on the non-approved list will not be allowed in ASA.

FAST PITCH for 2013 and BEYOND in ASA

There will NOT be any changes for Certification Mark and Test Standard for all bats used in the game of ASA Fast Pitch Softball for the 2013 season.

The current 2000 and 2004 Certification Marks will continue to be the appropriate Marks for the Fast Pitch bats.

Any new models produced by the manufacturers will continue to display the 2004 Certification Mark for bats used in the game of Fast Pitch Softball for ASA.

 

[Gamble]

Hey, awesome, a months-old repost that contains exactly 0% new information! Just what I've always wanted!

 

[SevenBizzos]

Even though that press release contained the following statement "All bats currently listed on the approved bat lists will remain legal for ASA;", we'll continue to get the eminent banning (because someone's brother knows the custodian at ASA headquarters and he told him) questions.

 

[dttruax]

Yea, not much new here..... although I wish they would have gotten NCAA, etc. on board for FP. Guess NCAA is still using the 47/375 ball. But as long as I can still use bats w/the 2004 ASA stamp in SP, there shouldn't be a problem if I want to use a new "FP bat" in SP. But will the SP bats w/the new certification mark be better than the FP bats w/2004 mark due to the different testing protocol and balls? That's the question. Kinda mucks things up for the manufacturers.

 

[SeanSic]

Hey, awesome, a months-old repost that contains exactly 0% new information! Just what I've always wanted!

Eat it Gamble

 

[irishmafia]

Hey, awesome, a months-old repost that contains exactly 0% new information! Just what I've always wanted!

Actually, this is a post that ASA just released yesterday and it does contain new information.

 

[vlcmstnaz]

Yea, not much new here..... although I wish they would have gotten NCAA, etc. on board for FP. Guess NCAA is still using the 47/375 ball. But as long as I can still use bats w/the 2004 ASA stamp in SP, there shouldn't be a problem if I want to use a new "FP bat" in SP. But will the SP bats w/the new certification mark be better than the FP bats w/2004 mark due to the different testing protocol and balls? That's the question. Kinda mucks things up for the manufacturers.

^^^This is what I want to know, and soon!! Got a FP bat I'm considering sending in for return. But, I want to know if I should hold out for a FP bat under the new testing protocol. Let's get some FP gurus in here!

 

[chrometip78]

Don't think they are changing the fp testing protocol, could've misread it though.

 

[dttruax]

Don't think they are changing the fp testing protocol, could've misread it though.

Not yet. Heard a rumor they might for 2014. It actually has to do a lot with NCAA and what they want to do.

 

[eddieq]

^^^This is what I want to know, and soon!! Got a FP bat I'm considering sending in for return. But, I want to know if I should hold out for a FP bat under the new testing protocol. Let's get some FP gurus in here!

FAST PITCH for 2013 and BEYOND in ASA

There will NOT be any changes for Certification Mark and Test Standard for all bats used in the game of ASA Fast Pitch Softball for the 2013 season.

The current 2000 and 2004 Certification Marks will continue to be the appropriate Marks for the Fast Pitch bats.

Any new models produced by the manufacturers will continue to display the 2004 Certification Mark for bats used in the game of Fast Pitch Softball for ASA.

 

[vlcmstnaz]

FAST PITCH for 2013 and BEYOND in ASA

There will NOT be any changes for Certification Mark and Test Standard for all bats used in the game of ASA Fast Pitch Softball for the 2013 season.

The current 2000 and 2004 Certification Marks will continue to be the appropriate Marks for the Fast Pitch bats.

Any new models produced by the manufacturers will continue to display the 2004 Certification Mark for bats used in the game of Fast Pitch Softball for ASA.

i'm not a big fastpitch follower. when was the last time FP standards were changed? i assume they were toned down post 2008 with the rest of the ASA bats, right? so, with ASA SP you'll get something like: pre-abi > post-abi < new standard. and, with ASA FP we've only got: pre-abi > post-abi, right?

 

[irishmafia]

i'm not a big fastpitch follower. when was the last time FP standards were changed? i assume they were toned down post 2008 with the rest of the ASA bats, right? so, with ASA SP you'll get something like: pre-abi > post-abi < new standard. and, with ASA FP we've only got: pre-abi > post-abi, right?

Apparently, you aren't much of a reader, either. Every bit of what you have mentioned is.....well, hooey. ASA standards have not changed in a decade and I'm referring to all bats.

The only thing that has changed recently is the ball used in testing and the simulated bat speed.

 

[vlcmstnaz]

^^^maybe it's just my reading comprehension.... :sigh:

 

[dttruax]

i'm not a big fastpitch follower. when was the last time FP standards were changed? i assume they were toned down post 2008 with the rest of the ASA bats, right? so, with ASA SP you'll get something like: pre-abi > post-abi < new standard. and, with ASA FP we've only got: pre-abi > post-abi, right?

Well first of all, ASA bats are ASA bats, only manufacturers market bats for FP or SP. So if it has the ASA stamp, then it meets ASA 98 MPH BBS standard. And as Irish said, the ASA standard isn't and hasn't changed, just the testing protocol. That's why the memo says "bats used in FP play", not FP bats.

Anyways, the NCAA uses the ASA approved bat list with their own "banned" list that's determined by their own random testing throughout the year. What I've read and heard is that NCAA isn't changing their ball like ASA is so the NCAA prefers to use bats tested under the old protocol, hence the 2004 ASA stamp.

 

[mcia]

So correct me if I am wrong......In 2013, fastpitch bats will still continue to be legal for slowpitch?

 

[eddieq]

So correct me if I am wrong......In 2013, fastpitch bats will still continue to be legal for slowpitch?

In 2013, bats bearing the 2000, 2004 or Logo stamp and not appearing on the "Non-approved bats with stamps" list will be legal in the slow pitch game in ASA.

 

[NCASAUmp]

So correct me if I am wrong......In 2013, fastpitch bats will still continue to be legal for slowpitch?

If a bat ONLY has the new stamp without either the 2000 or 2004 stamp accompanying, the bat may not be used in ASA fast pitch. However, it may be used in ASA slow pitch.

This change does not affect the slow pitch game, only the fast pitch game.

 

[irishmafia]

If a bat ONLY has the new stamp without either the 2000 or 2004 stamp accompanying, the bat may not be used in ASA fast pitch. However, it may be used in ASA slow pitch.

This change does not affect the slow pitch game, only the fast pitch game.

Actually, it doesn't really affect the FP game, it is just that manufacturer's may submit a bat for SP only and that bat will not go through the standard testing that would earn it a 2004 stamp if it passed.

I think the manufacturers would be fools to fall into this trap.

 

[mcia]

Actually, it doesn't really affect the FP game, it is just that manufacturer's may submit a bat for SP only and that bat will not go through the standard testing that would earn it a 2004 stamp if it passed.

I think the manufacturers would be fools to fall into this trap.

I'm guessing that a bat for SP could pass both standards without being way under the 98mph limit?

 

[dttruax]

I'm guessing that a bat for SP could pass both standards without being way under the 98mph limit?

I'd say yes. I would also say that the newer bats (2012-2013) with only the 2004 ASA stamp, but "designed for use with low compression balls", would pass both certification tests... and we know how hot some of them are.

 

[dttruax]

Actually, it doesn't really affect the FP game, it is just that manufacturer's may submit a bat for SP only and that bat will not go through the standard testing that would earn it a 2004 stamp if it passed.

I think the manufacturers would be fools to fall into this trap.

Possibly, but so few bats for SP are used in FP to begin with (at least w/NCAA, etc.). I could see manufacturers submitting "FP bats" for both stamps for use in SP rather than vice versa. But who knows. Only time will tell.

 

[mattgame]

So with the new 100mph standards, we can expect new bats to be hotter out of the wrapper?

 

[dttruax]

So with the new 100mph standards, we can expect new bats to be hotter out of the wrapper?

where's the big facepalm?

 

[irishmafia]

Possibly, but so few bats for SP are used in FP to begin with (at least w/NCAA, etc.). I could see manufacturers submitting "FP bats" for both stamps for use in SP rather than vice versa. But who knows. Only time will tell.

I think there are a fair share used by some of the power hitters, but that wasn't my point.

If you tell the lab to test for SP, you have a single target market, SP. Other than the bat *****s, I doubt many SP players are going to buy both bats, especially if it is ASA only for SP.

Meanwhile, the FP folks will not even look at the SP bats which means a separate production line must now exists, but the number of possible clients is the same. There may be a surge for new product, but I don't see that becoming sustainable income unless the FP side of the game takes a step up to the different ball and bat.

Of course, this could be offset by the newer bats being approved for U-trip and ASA, but the market may still take a hit since the player doesn't need to buy a new bat for both associations because they can get by with just the one.

 

[Gulf Coast Blue]

I have only known a few FP girls over the years that used bats that were developed for SP sales. They swung them fine. My oldest daughter swung a 25 oz. bat in some of her HS games (which was heavy for girls SB) and did ok. Also...the weight of a bat can vary depending on where the center of gravity is. This is the same for both SP and FP bats.

Two of my daughters still play softball......one 25 and one 20.....my 24 yo has a wrecked ankle and can still get talked into being a sub or replacement player if needed

.

 

[mcia]

I could see manufacturers submitting "FP bats" for both stamps for use in SP rather than vice versa. But who knows. Only time will tell.

I'm under the impression that manufacturers of new "FP bats" would only be submitting the bat for one ASA stamp which is the 2004 because that stamp will still be acceptable for FP bats to be used in the game of slow pitch....

 

[irishmafia]

I'm under the impression that manufacturers of new "FP bats" would only be submitting the bat for one ASA stamp which is the 2004 because that stamp will still be acceptable for FP bats to be used in the game of slow pitch....

From what I have been told, the manufacturers have the discretion to offer the bat for testing for one of the two designations. Unless it is cost-prohibitive, I assume there is no reason the manufacturer couldn't submit a bat for both tests.

 

[mcia]

But if the manufacturer only submits the bat for the 2004 certification mark then the bat can be used in both sp and fp...there would be no need to submit it to get the new asa stamp which only pertains to sp bats being used in sp only

 

[Jimz7p]

Seems to be a little confusion when people talk about bats being slow pitch vs fast pitch. ASA does not consider bats to be slow pitch or fast pitch. ASA standards apply the game not the type of bat. Until this year, the game of slow pitch and fast pitch used the same standard. Next year, the game of slow pitch will recognize an additional stamp that is not recognized by fast pitch.

If it is true that the new slow pitch stamp is hotter than the 2004 stamp, we may very likely see slow pitch bats come in sizes and weights traditionally associated with fast pitch bats, but designed to meet the new standard of slow pitch. We may also see some fast pitch bats come in heavier weights for the mens fast pitch and modified leagues.

Is modified fast pitch going to follow the fast pitch rules going forward?

 

[irishmafia]

But if the manufacturer only submits the bat for the 2004 certification mark then the bat can be used in both sp and fp...there would be no need to submit it to get the new asa stamp which only pertains to sp bats being used in sp only

That is correct.