NSA What is the penalty for a team using an illegal ball?

djcs1204

King Jackie!!!
So, if a team throws in an illegal ball and it is caught, then thrown out, and then thrown back into the game and contact with the ball is made by the batter what is the ruling? They slipped it in on a buddy of mine's team this past weekend and the director simply said it was on the pitcher because he threw the ball and didn't toss it from the game. I don't believe that is the whole truth.
 

irishmafia

Addicted to Softballfans
So, if a team throws in an illegal ball and it is caught, then thrown out, and then thrown back into the game and contact with the ball is made by the batter what is the ruling? They slipped it in on a buddy of mine's team this past weekend and the director simply said it was on the pitcher because he threw the ball and didn't toss it from the game. I don't believe that is the whole truth.

This is why every ball goes through me as the PU. One of the reasons I avoid the "hit your own" crap. Because it is real simple, the players will cheat and they WILL put the umpire in the middle and I'm not taking **** because of an ******* player.
 

djcs1204

King Jackie!!!
I totally understand man. I particularly like tourneys where the balls have to be bought at the complex. Especially if I am umping instead of playing. Now onto the penalty. I always thought that the batter who hit the ball was out, and the coach was ejected.
 

J MO

Best home run hitter in E
This happened to me in NSA last month. Our bench coach accidentally threw in a TA when I was up.. The pitcher presented the ball to the umpire and I was called out without even seeing a pitch..
 

djcs1204

King Jackie!!!
That is more along the lines of what I was looking for. I need a rule though. I have looked through the rule book and cant find anything but I honestly think I may be overlooking it.
 

eddieq

The Great and Powerful Q
Why is the umpire allowing a ball to come in play without it coming through him?

Personally, if I was calling the game and they threw in an illegal ball and I threw it out and then later they tried to sneak it in again, I'd eject both the player trying to throw the ball in and the head coach.
 

IBUNT

Addicted to Softballfans
If the coach is also a player, and had nothing to do with throwing the ball in.... Is it really right to eject him too?
 

djcs1204

King Jackie!!!
If the coach is also a player, and had nothing to do with throwing the ball in.... Is it really right to eject him too?

Yes it is. Simply because you can NOT prove who threw the ball in and the coach accepts the blame for the actions of his team. Almost every league/tourney that I have played in if a player goes, the coach goes.
 

EAJuggalo

Addicted to Softballfans
Why was the ball illegal? If the umpire thought the ball was altered it's a forfeit, ejection and possible two year ban. If it's because of the COR and Comp I'm tossing the manager for unsportsmanlike conduct, which I might have done the first time in a tournament.
 

spos21ram

The Legend
I don't understand why league's don't supply the balls. Laziness? All league's have to do is factor in the cost of balls into the league fee's. LD's would avoid a lot of trouble like this.
 

NCASAUmp

Un-Retired
I don't understand why league's don't supply the balls. Laziness? All league's have to do is factor in the cost of balls into the league fee's. LD's would avoid a lot of trouble like this.

It'd just add to the drama. Each team has their preferences for which ball is "best," while some don't care.

So do you appease the ball snobs who only want to hit the best, thus passing along the increased cost to everyone else? Or do you play it cheaper?
 

jsam21238

Addicted to Softballfans
That is more along the lines of what I was looking for. I need a rule though. I have looked through the rule book and cant find anything but I honestly think I may be overlooking it.

I guess you didn't like the answers in the NSA section. You arent finding an answer because there is nothing pertaining to it in the rule book.

Rule books are written for championship play in which balls will be supplied. There is nothing in the rule book on how to deal with this.
 
I don't understand why league's don't supply the balls. Laziness? All league's have to do is factor in the cost of balls into the league fee's. LD's would avoid a lot of trouble like this.

Because leagues have a bad habit of supplying inferior equipment when given the opportunity. The LD sees Champros at $25/dozen vs. $40 or so for "decent" league-type of balls and we know what he picks.

I think all leagues should be hit your own ball (and bat). Players will take care of the balls (so there's no time wasted chasing them down), they can hit what legal ball they choose, and it's lowers the cost of running the league. I don't think it's much to ask of a pitcher to look at the ball the other team is hitting. If he's letting them hit a better (illegal) ball, that's on him (to me).
 

SouthernOhioNSA

Addicted to Softballfans
We were told before June 1 to treat it like walking into the box with an illegal bat. Whether that is correct leads me to wonder as we are all over the place with procedures. I am going to see if I can word a proposal for tournaments that offer the option to hit-your-own that maybe can get us on the same page and is also in print.

I was one who never thought HYO would ever work. I also did a lot of business with Worth back then and they would sponsor my state tournaments with gear, etc for buying so much quantity. Those were the good ole' days. I would use the same balls in June/July that we supplied in late March/Early April and just get shredded over it. The same ball they couldn't remotely keep in the yard in March was dying like a quail 15-25 feet from the fence. I had a B state tournament game around 2005 that was on a 90+ degree day that was 6-3 with one over the fence home run. A storm blew thru and when we got back on the field it was 20 degrees cooler and now we have DBO's in the bottom of the second because they were already over the 4 HR's in the first inning and the other team hadnt gone into one-up yet using the exact same ball as earlier in the day!

Our first year of HYO was tough the first few times out, but we adapted. One team come up to me complaining about the ball being dead and I almost burst out laughing because they supplied it not me. :) Of course I sold them some Dudley's and they went away happy.

The D Worlds we supplied the ball, the only problem I ever had with me supplying them was I spent all day on the other side of the fence chasing home run balls. Someone would ask me how good a team was and all I could say was I saw about 1 inning per game they played so I don't know.
 

spos21ram

The Legend
It'd just add to the drama. Each team has their preferences for which ball is "best," while some don't care.

So do you appease the ball snobs who only want to hit the best, thus passing along the increased cost to everyone else? Or do you play it cheaper?

I buy trumps for my league. Very good ball for very low cost. Can't beat it.
 

Pumacat35

Professional Hitter
It'd just add to the drama. Each team has their preferences for which ball is "best," while some don't care.

So do you appease the ball snobs who only want to hit the best, thus passing along the increased cost to everyone else? Or do you play it cheaper?

Pass the cost on. Its only an extra $ 25 a team. Every tournament I run I give each team a 1/2 doz tournament game balls.........their team name is written on each of the 6 balls in a colored sharpie ( I use a different color for each tournament) and those are the only balls the umpires allow in.

Its great for everybody, games are never held up because of lack of softballs, quality balls are always used, if the team does not want to chase HR balls they just throw another out, and I have more to buy for $5 each. I will gladly collect them after the tournament and add them to my BP box.
 

NCASAUmp

Un-Retired
Pass the cost on. Its only an extra $ 25 a team. Every tournament I run I give each team a 1/2 doz tournament game balls.........their team name is written on each of the 6 balls in a colored sharpie ( I use a different color for each tournament) and those are the only balls the umpires allow in.

Its great for everybody, games are never held up because of lack of softballs, quality balls are always used, if the team does not want to chase HR balls they just throw another out, and I have more to buy for $5 each. I will gladly collect them after the tournament and add them to my BP box.

I have no problem with that. One less way players can cheat.
 

SouthernOhioNSA

Addicted to Softballfans
Games should never be held up for lack of softballs. Our officials are told that after one goes out of play to get set back up and give them 5 seconds to get a ball in the game. Then call play and the impetus is on the hitting team to get one in within another 5 seconds or a strike is called just like the rulebook says. This means the offensive team has 10 seconds to get a ball in play.

If teams send balls out with the third base coach, the coach can send one to the pitcher after a ball goes out of play. Think co-ed here where the third base coach is always rotating the 11" & 12" ball.

Our officials are also told to have the ball go back to the third base coach at the end of the inning and to NOT let the defensive team take it into the dugout. With the multi-layers being removed from the approved equipment list on June 1, it would be too easy for a defensive player to slip a non-approved ball into the pitchers glove and then protest the next time the other team is hitting.

Its great for everybody, games are never held up because of lack of softballs,
 
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