Your know what? I went back and watched the video that joker posted and although I have seen it many times I just realized......where is the slide? Utley touches the ground for a split second! The "slide" doesn't even start until he is literally almost even with the bag! Watch it again and judge for yourself.
Other Chase Utley's slide at 2nd
- Thread starter rhound50
- Start date
irishmafia
Addicted to Softballfans
Speaking of bull****, Tejada had is back to 1st base and didn't have a play at 1st base. He saw Utley coming over his right shoulder, reversed and turned as to throw and IMO may not have had any intention of releasing the ball.
frontagerdmaui
White Samoan
Tejada had thought he had made the force at second and was moving out of the way to make an attempt at the DP. Whether he had a chance or not, Utley ran out of the base path away from 2nd to deliberately hammer Tejada. Released ball or not. Utley is an ASS.
rhound50
Rec Coed Superstar
The rule is he has to be able to touch the base from where he slides not that he actually has to touch it. I totally agree the rule should be changed, I just find it stupid that Utley should be suspended for something that has happened hundreds of times and not been a suspension. To me all the people calling for a suspension are the same people who wanted that kid Cousins suspended for breaking Buster Posey's ankle when by the current set of rules he had done nothing wrong.
If you really don't think slides like this are a part of the game you either don't watch a lot of baseball or don't know its history of the game or both. This play has happened hundreds of times in the last decade and no one has been suspended for it, most of the time the SS gets up and nothing comes of it because no one is hurt. Even the times that they are, Chris Couglan broke Kang's leg in a very similar slide this year, Matt Holliday knocked Marco Scutaro out of the playoffs with the same late slide a couple years ago and neither were suspended. Your argument is its purely your opinion of what is right and wrong and totally ignores both the rules and history of baseball. Both players and umpires are taught that the runner just needs to be able to touch the base and its a legal slide. Utley's intentions are irrelevant because he is not breaking the rules, how do you suspend someone unless they break a rule?
Sully
Wanna buy jerseys/rings?
I thought Holliday should have been suspended to if that counts. What he did isn't "part of the game", he tackled a player. That's not a good clean double play break up, that's sliding in high past the base with the intent of flipping the fielder. It's a dirty play. What Utley did is a dirty play. Baseball is slowly wising up. These players are an investment. Most professional sports are a game of superstars. Baseball and the NFL playing with Scabs proved that. People still watched because it was football but the ratings sucked. No one knew who those scrubs were. It's not an accident the TV stations advertise "Trout vs Puig" or Kershaw vs Arietta.
We used to let guys Trout's size with his speed take a 30 yard running head start, leave his feet and tackle a stationary guy "because that's how the game was always played". We used to play tackle football with leather helmets but there's no way that would fly now. Baseball, like football, is a demanding sport. That doesn't mean we should allow a guy to come in high like Holliday did and tackle a guy in the air trying to make a baseball play. I'm not saying you shouldn't be able to break up a double play, there should just be limitations on it.
Continuing to allow players to make dirty plays because the rule has never been changed to protect the players is dumb. That kind of play is one of the reasons the neighborhood play has been listed on the non-reviewable plays since instant replay came out. They didn't have to be exactly on the bag as long as they were close to offer the fielder some sort of protection.
We used to let guys Trout's size with his speed take a 30 yard running head start, leave his feet and tackle a stationary guy "because that's how the game was always played". We used to play tackle football with leather helmets but there's no way that would fly now. Baseball, like football, is a demanding sport. That doesn't mean we should allow a guy to come in high like Holliday did and tackle a guy in the air trying to make a baseball play. I'm not saying you shouldn't be able to break up a double play, there should just be limitations on it.
Continuing to allow players to make dirty plays because the rule has never been changed to protect the players is dumb. That kind of play is one of the reasons the neighborhood play has been listed on the non-reviewable plays since instant replay came out. They didn't have to be exactly on the bag as long as they were close to offer the fielder some sort of protection.
FatBoy28
SBF is a cruel Mistress
At some point something happens that catches people’s attention that makes them say we have let this go too far. Utley just happens to be that guy in this case. I’m less worried about suspending Utley than I am that the application of the rule needs to be looked at. It doesn’t make any sense that the rules protect the guy in full gear but it is apparently open season on a guy turning a DP. With all the guys getting upended when was the last time you saw interference called on the guy breaking up the DP? If Belle didn’t get the interference call when he unloaded on Vina in ‘86 how do you call it on anybody anymore?
irishmafia
Addicted to Softballfans
Utley did what is expected of every baserunner in the game. I don't agree with it, but a fielder being defenseless is a bull**** argument, this isn't that ***** sport of football.
GOING 4 THIRD
Member
All of a sudden no one watches football.
Allow me to clarify
TACKLE vs. CHARGING BLOCK
TACKLE definition:
Transitive verb
:to attach or secure with or as if with tackle
2a :to seize, take hold of, or grapple with especially with the intention of stopping or subduing
b :to seize and throw down or stop (an opposing player with the ball) in football
G
(SEIZE definition:
verb
1.take hold of suddenly and forcibly.
"she jumped up and seized his arm"
synonyms: grab, grasp, snatch, take hold of, get one's hands on)
BLOCK definition
a :to make unsuitable for passage or progress by obstruction
b archaic :blockade
c :to hinder the passage, progress, or accomplishment of by or as if by interposing an obstruction
d :to shut off from view
e :to interfere usually legitimately with (as an opponent) in various games or sports
f :to prevent normal functioning or action of
g :to restrict the exchange of (as currency or checks)
It wasn't a tackle, it was a charging block he tried to sell as a slide.
I'd believe it more if ya'll called it a 'defective flying knee', but we all know what a tackle is, it was a sports broadcasters way of verbalizing that there is now room for this kind of play in this sport, but how many people are gunna repeat him already
Allow me to clarify
TACKLE vs. CHARGING BLOCK
TACKLE definition:
Transitive verb
:to attach or secure with or as if with tackle
2a :to seize, take hold of, or grapple with especially with the intention of stopping or subduing
b :to seize and throw down or stop (an opposing player with the ball) in football
G
(SEIZE definition:
verb
1.take hold of suddenly and forcibly.
"she jumped up and seized his arm"
synonyms: grab, grasp, snatch, take hold of, get one's hands on)
BLOCK definition
a :to make unsuitable for passage or progress by obstruction
b archaic :blockade
c :to hinder the passage, progress, or accomplishment of by or as if by interposing an obstruction
d :to shut off from view
e :to interfere usually legitimately with (as an opponent) in various games or sports
f :to prevent normal functioning or action of
g :to restrict the exchange of (as currency or checks)
It wasn't a tackle, it was a charging block he tried to sell as a slide.
I'd believe it more if ya'll called it a 'defective flying knee', but we all know what a tackle is, it was a sports broadcasters way of verbalizing that there is now room for this kind of play in this sport, but how many people are gunna repeat him already
Trung1130
FREE AGENT FOR LIFE
It's a failure of MLB and the umpires to actually enforce the rule that is in the book. Torre quoted the rule that should've been enforced. If this rule had been enforced properly and consistently, the players would know what is acceptable and unacceptable and where that fine line exists. Just like retaliating to plunk a guy. Do it but don't go after his head.
Back to the slide; at no time did Utley intend to make contact with the bag during the "slide" or after the collision. If an umpire can not use his judgment to make that call then he shouldn't be on the field.
Back to the slide; at no time did Utley intend to make contact with the bag during the "slide" or after the collision. If an umpire can not use his judgment to make that call then he shouldn't be on the field.
GOING 4 THIRD
Member
There where many, many calls this year both behind the plate and in the field that made me question some umpires being on the field. Are there actually reprocussions for getting saved 10 times by replay or ballooning the strike zone or noticably pushing it away and down? It doesn't seem so; at a professional level these guys make a Ton of money to get the calls right. Granted its everywhere in every sport at every level, but do they get sent down to umping MiLB games if they blow too many? Maybe they should get designated for assignment like every other professional on the field not pulling there weight. There are stats everywhere, they gotta keep track of and know who's most notorious for raising eyebrows and voices
rhound50
Rec Coed Superstar
It doesn't matter, what players and umpires are taught is the runner has to be able to touch the bag as part of the slide, he does not actually have to touch it.
frontagerdmaui
White Samoan
I don't know if the OG posters are fans of Utley himself or his team by defending the action. The Dodgers are out of the Playoffs so Utley's suspension really doesn't mean anything. 2 Game suspension in a 162 game season is like suspending an NFL player for a set of Downs.
As far as Downs are concerned, anyone who defends players who risk another players health/career, they must have Downs Syndrome because to use the term "Part of the game" in that instance is Retarded.
As far as Downs are concerned, anyone who defends players who risk another players health/career, they must have Downs Syndrome because to use the term "Part of the game" in that instance is Retarded.
GOING 4 THIRD
Member
Yeah definitely, a 2-game suspension is like leaving a dollar tip. A consolation smack in the face. Now this kid has to watch his team in the world series laid up in a fracture walker. And I just got over a fibula break from june and my legs still very stiff, I would not be quick to forgive.
Last edited:
Sully
Wanna buy jerseys/rings?
It's interesting you mention them keeping stats. I've never seen the information on MLB, but I know the NFL sends report cards after every game. They critique every play and suggest how the league would have liked those plays called. They use those report cards to determine who gets to work what in the playoffs. From reading the article, the officials take those report cards very serious.
Sully
Wanna buy jerseys/rings?
The 2 game suspension would have meant much more if MLB heard the suspension immediately and made a decision that affected the playoffs.
rmarsh
Addicted to Softballfans
I don't think Utley did it to intentionally hurt anybody. I am not a fan of his but he has hardly made a bad name for himself for doing things to other players. It was a hard play and a bad decision to try and advance his teammates further in the inning the way he did. It wasn't against the rules, but not in good taste until the rules are changed.
The top videos are ridiculous, old 70's bull****! The bottom videos, each one of them slid in the same exact way Utley did without hurting anyone. The reason Tejada got hurt was because he had his back to the play! If he'd had been in the right position, he may have got a few scrapes on his hands from the ground.
Belles take out should have been suspended! With the onset of concussions and evidence of their long term effects, he might have been sued in today's society. purely intentional and was meant to hurt him.
Last edited:
frontagerdmaui
White Samoan
I have watched PLENTY of Baseball in my 47 years on this Green Earth. I have watched plenty of videos of ski/snowboard/motorcycle/skateboard crashes as well. Maybe it is my AGE. But when I was young I would laugh my ass off watching people get hurt on film. Now, I cringe at them. When you get old enough, you realize you are not unbreakable. When I watched Utley slide I cringed before I even knew Tejada was injured seriously. Maybe 20 yrs ago I would be the random "It's part of the game" guy. But I look at that video and think about what should of been done right. And if I were Utley, I would have stood up as tall as I could and been an obstruction for the throw and not a demolition team to the SS's leg. The rules are wrong. And EVERYONE who breaks up a DP in this manner should be suspended. Baseball is not a contact sport or they would be issued protection.
From the other angle he clearly starts his slide before the bag. It's late, but before the bag. He's in the baseline, and his hand is heading straight for the bag when he takes a knee to the face.
I don't think he expected Tejada to come back that way because he didn't even put his hand up to protect his own face.
In case you weren't aware, he broke his right leg. It was a completely freak thing. His cleats weren't even stuck in the ground like Scutaro's when Holliday rolled up his leg. That was damned near a choir boy slide compared to those other ones posted.
I also think Mattingly sat him because of this, regardless of the appeal on the suspension. Why else do you not play an offensive 2B against the Mets he's faced more than anyone else on the team? I'm also not surprised there's talk of firing Mattingly.
Sully
Wanna buy jerseys/rings?
From the other angle he clearly starts his slide before the bag. It's late, but before the bag. He's in the baseline, and his hand is heading straight for the bag when he takes a knee to the face.
I don't think he expected Tejada to come back that way because he didn't even put his hand up to protect his own face.
In case you weren't aware, he broke his right leg. It was a completely freak thing. His cleats weren't even stuck in the ground like Scutaro's when Holliday rolled up his leg. That was damned near a choir boy slide compared to those other ones posted.
I also think Mattingly sat him because of this, regardless of the appeal on the suspension. Why else do you not play an offensive 2B against the Mets he's faced more than anyone else on the team? I'm also not surprised there's talk of firing Mattingly.
Technically, he might have started his slide before the bag, but his knees (the first thing that touched the ground) didn't touch the ground until halfway through the bag. He almost leaped at Tejada. It wasn't a normal slide on his butt and leg. His breaking Tejada's leg was a complete fluke, it looks like Tejada's leg might have gotten caught between Utley's legs in an awkward fashion. I'm not saying it was dirty because Tejada happened to get his leg broken. It was dirty because he almost jumped to get far enough to get past the bag still up on his knees mostly upright so he could barrel into Tejada's upper thighs and midsection. Catching the knee to the head wasn't in his original plan I'm sure. Torre called it a dirty slide. He's not only been around baseball for a looong time, he's currently in charge of baseball operations or whatever his official title is. Just because Albert Bell waylayed people in the 80's doesn't make it any better to do what Utley did. The rule needs to be changed. I can see the why suspend now argument, but sometimes it takes a high profile play to change the rule. I think this is the one.
frontagerdmaui
White Samoan
Can't we all just agree it was a D I C K move by Utley????
Got no problem with that, but Cal Ripken called it a good hard play, and since he'd usually be in Tejada's shoes when these plays take place, I'll listen to him a little more than Torre. I've never really paid attention to Utley's sliding style, but I'll assume it was changed to take him out. Since it's not illegal, and happens all the time, I have no problem with it.
Holliday's looked more like that McRae slide, but because he doesn't get his leg broken, or because it was a few years ago when people still had balls, it wasn't considered a big deal.
I'm fine with changing the rule as long as it doesn't become the **** show that home plate is now. I don't want to see people get hurt. I also don't want to see stupid things like a half moon painted on the floor beneath the basket because referees don't have the balls to make the correct calls.
Holliday's looked more like that McRae slide, but because he doesn't get his leg broken, or because it was a few years ago when people still had balls, it wasn't considered a big deal.
I'm fine with changing the rule as long as it doesn't become the **** show that home plate is now. I don't want to see people get hurt. I also don't want to see stupid things like a half moon painted on the floor beneath the basket because referees don't have the balls to make the correct calls.
bpierce208
Addicted to Softballfans
You can't listen to Cal Ripken about this, because nobody is sliding into THE Cal Ripken like this...