Any Coach, I didn't see it.

[TMoney970]

Situation. 12U USFA Fastpitch WS Tournament
Bases Loaded, 2 Outs. 2-2 ball game.
Batter hits a grounder down the 3rd base side, foul, well at least to everyone with 20/20 vision.
Right handed F5 dives toward foul line, glove in foul territory, but ball is outside her reach.
R3, in foul territory, jumps up to avoid being hit.
And 3rd base coach jumps back, to also avoid being hit.

PU removes mask, yet signals absolutely nothing. Doesn't point fair, nor raise hands to indicate foul nor yell foul ball. He just stands there.
BU in C position, looks dumbfounded but offers no help, as it was not his call.

Well, offense scores 3 runs with batter/runner getting a triple.

Time is called and we ask for help on this. After much arguing, the PU turns around to everyone including the stands and says, look, " I'm being honest, I didn't see it".

Was this not putting one team in jeapordy?
Was this protestable?
Was there anything that can really be done here?
(We did find the UIC before play resumed, and he couldn't believe the PU said that, and stayed to watch the remainder of the game.)

Our team did come back to win the game, but this was just bad.

 

[spos21ram]

Nothing can be done. Fair/Foul is a judgment call.

 

[jsam21238]

You play until the whistle. Always assume the ball is in play and live until told different.

 

[MaverickAH]

What did the BU say? While it is technically not his call, he should still be watching the play & providing a second pair of eyes. Did he not have an opinion on where the ball was? Saying that it's not his call is not acceptable. This is a call that both umpires should have gotten together on & got right.

 

[jsam21238]

What did the BU say? While it is technically not his call, he should still be watching the play & providing a second pair of eyes. Did he not have an opinion on where the ball was? Saying that it's not his call is not acceptable. This is a call that both umpires should have gotten together on & got right.

How's an umpire in C supposed to see a ball down the line.

To the OP... was this a bounding ball or a ball in flight?

 

[BigSam]

HTBT and all that, but the truth is sometimes you just can't see a close fair/foul at third especially one that is hammered. Now I ump adults and this is 12U so I'm not sure if that is the case (got there too fast to get in proper position) or if the ump just was daydreaming. As described that's a terrible call, but you know how that goes.

No redress for a fair/foul call. Play through it.

 

[TMoney970]

The ball was hit hard, on the ground, no large bounces, passing clearly in foul territory by the dust spots the the ball kicked up where it did hit the ground by 3rd base. Not talking about a few inches, but by a couple of feet foul.

Our main issue was the fact that the PU actually admitted that he did not see it. Yet, he lets it play as if fair. Plus, he just stood there, signalling neither fair nor foul.

By his not seeing it, is he not placing one team at a disadvantage?
Then by not calling or signalling, either way, is he not adding on to the problem. (Although, by not seeing it, he couldn't call it.)

The BU, in his defense, probably didn't see it as it was hit hard. Now, he admitted that he did see R3, in foul territory, jump to avoid the ball, and the 3rd base coach jump back to avoid getting hit as well, but he said he did not see the ball until it was past them already.

 

[jsam21238]

There isn't a redo in this situation... if a ball is hit and you hear nothing called play it as fair every single time.

 

[rhound50]

This is a good teaching moment for your kids. Play til someone tells you to stop, the rule for any ball player should be that if you dont hear anything verbal from an umpire you keep playing til someone tells you to stop. Sounds like the umpire got the call wrong but his biggest mistake was what he said. Admitting to not seeing the play guarantees that even if he got the call right one team is gonna feel like they got screwed and want something to be done to fix it. The BU is not going to have a good angle to see fair or foul here so even when the PU says nothing he should not make any call. What should happen after the play is the coach and no one else should talk to the PU. Something along the line of "I know the BU doesnt have a good angle but from where I was standing the ball was pretty far foul. Can you please ask him what he saw and see if he can give you help since you didn't see the play." If that doesn't work you are SOL, the play can't be protested time to move on.

 

[AJ22]

A batted ball is always fair until an umpire calls/yells foul ..

A runner is always safe until an umpire calls a runner out ..


And to get a little technical here, where was your 3rd baseman at? In front of the bag or behind the bag? I've seen balls bounce from in fair territory into foul territory but not until after passing fair by the bag. That means your 3rd baseman and her glove in foul territory has no bearing if your 3rd baseman was behind the bag.

If 3rd baseman was in front of the bag, is it possible the ball deflected passed your diving 3rd baseman in foul territory untouched and bounced back into fair territory? I've seen this as well.

In the umpire's defense, he did not see he play. Therefore, the ball should be played as a live and fair ball unless called foul by an umpire.

 

[OldguyinHavasu]

How did you get Stevie Wonder to be your plate umpire, and how much did it cost?

 

[Gulf Coast Blue]

You played USFA......enough said.

 

[MDUmp]

You played USFA......enough said.

I'm sure that was very helpful. This isn't the lounge.