The era of the 52, can you say old school

[Bobby Buggs]

Funny this would be on here the same time I made this post,
http://forums.softballfans.com/showpost.php?p=15036765&postcount=7
Some of you laugh at me cause they saw video of my trying to pull the ball and hit HRs. Thing is I was a total top spin guy and it was what made me a success in my 20s and 30s. I knew I was not gifted enough to hit the ball 300 feet so I spend years being a top spin guy. Trying to hit Hrs was totally the opposite of what I trained my self to do and it showed.

 

[BL18ok]

couple things I see wrong with this thread...I'm a 5'8 190lbs guy that hit more HRs this year (34), hitting the 52/300 than I had in the 4 previous years (30), so I really wish that people would quit complaining about the ball. back in the day, the ball was like a rock, mostly .47cor balls is what we used in the early 90s when I started playing, and the combo of good metal bats and the balls made for some crazy scoring. and maybe I'm an exception, but back in the day I hit my fair share of HRs with metal bats. I truly wish that the "this ball sucks" and the "what's the best ASA bat" threads would stop. softball is a game, and I would guess that there are less than 1% of the people on this board that get paid to play, so go out and play the game.

The fact the you know the number bothers me.

 

[grubd]

So, you're admitting that all the composite cowboys are poor hitters outside of their homers? That's what your statement says to me. I started playing in the early 90s in college, and the teams I was on were still scoring 15, 20, 25 runs a game by merely using base hits and good base-running. Good hitters will still be good hitters and composite cowboys will be exposed and forced to learn how to hit line drives more consistently.

Why wouldn't today's hitters adjust and hit the single or more than likely gappers for doubles and triples. With the training and video equipment today players are much better.

 

[Flyman]

couple things I see wrong with this thread...I'm a 5'8 190lbs guy that hit more HRs this year (34), hitting the 52/300 than I had in the 4 previous years (30), so I really wish that people would quit complaining about the ball. back in the day, the ball was like a rock, mostly .47cor balls is what we used in the early 90s when I started playing, and the combo of good metal bats and the balls made for some crazy scoring. and maybe I'm an exception, but back in the day I hit my fair share of HRs with metal bats. I truly wish that the "this ball sucks" and the "what's the best ASA bat" threads would stop. softball is a game, and I would guess that there are less than 1% of the people on this board that get paid to play, so go out and play the game.

You say you're 5'8" 190 like you're small, but that's not small. Maybe not tall, but it's not like you're slight of size. And if you're in shape, you are probably a pretty damn strong guy at 5'8" 190.

 

[JoePaterno]

Whenever people are playing or living in their prime, they always think that time frame is the best generation. It happens in all sports, and crosses over to other things (music, movies, television, clothes).

In the 70's and early 80's, it was 36 oz bats and T-4000 softballs. The T-4000's were deemed too hot, so they were banned and replaced with balls like the super dot in .47 and .50 cor, but we also started to see in innovation in bats, with the Worth Powercell, TPS PowerDome, and Easton Redlines. Then Demarini created the doublewall and really changed how technology affected the game. Who remembers hearing the pitcher yell, "Demarini!!" to the outfielders?

Composite bats entered the game and changed it forever, in my opinion to the negative. It took the associations way too long to adjust the ball specifications, but they are finally doing so, much to the chagrin of those who have relied on composites their entire time playing softball, especially for their power.

Softball needs to come back to being not just a home run hitters game, but a game that includes base hitting as well.

 

[Flyman]

Why wouldn't today's hitters adjust and hit the single or more than likely gappers for doubles and triples. With the training and video equipment today players are much better.

I'm in total agreement with you. I was just addressing gatornation suggesting the game will go to 4-2 games. I never said today's hitters wouldn't adjust. They'll have to if the balls are that soft.

 

[freak98guy]

Is this an "old guy jealous of young guy" butthurt thread?
Damn whipersnappers hitting home runs
In my day we had real talent

 

[Fro Joe]

Whenever people are playing or living in their prime, they always think that time frame is the best generation. It happens in all sports, and crosses over to other things (music, movies, television, clothes).

In the 70's and early 80's, it was 36 oz bats and T-4000 softballs. The T-4000's were deemed too hot, so they were banned and replaced with balls like the super dot in .47 and .50 cor, but we also started to see in innovation in bats, with the Worth Powercell, TPS PowerDome, and Easton Redlines. Then Demarini created the doublewall and really changed how technology affected the game. Who remembers hearing the pitcher yell, "Demarini!!" to the outfielders?

Composite bats entered the game and changed it forever, in my opinion to the negative. It took the associations way too long to adjust the ball specifications, but they are finally doing so, much to the chagrin of those who have relied on composites their entire time playing softball, especially for their power.

Softball needs to come back to being not just a home run hitters game, but a game that includes base hitting as well.

How often could you play softball while running a D-1 football program?

 

[Joker]

**** i hate agreeing with buggs

 

[chris21]

The fact the you know the number bothers me.

yeah...have a crazy thing about keeping stats...

 

[JoePaterno]

How often could you play softball while running a D-1 football program?

summer intramurals...

 

[Zarkoff500]

I really like the .52 COR ball and so far have no problems with distance. If this ball levels the playing field and keeps bats and players safer then I don't see a negative.

 

[chris21]

You say you're 5'8" 190 like you're small, but that's not small. Maybe not tall, but it's not like you're slight of size. And if you're in shape, you are probably a pretty damn strong guy at 5'8" 190.

I can hold my own....but back in the day, when I started playing softball after college, I was maybe 165-170. I really think that hitting, be it today or 15 years ago, is about swing mechanics.

 

[UptotheKnuckle]

 

[-TheHook-]

I get what the OP is saying... I used to love watching my Dad and Uncles play upper level ball. You never saw guys accidentally hit HR's like you do today. Especially 165lbers. They do need to adjust the ball, but they have too watch going to far. Some of these 52 balls seem to get bouncy as hell when they start lowering the core. I've noticed it a lot in league and especially with Worth balls. Infield is rough with some of these newer balls, gotta watch your grill. Also, I don't care how much the cores and compressions change because those damn Dudleys will always find their way out of a park. It's crazy how much harder those balls are and still approved.

 

[BIGPAPA33]

Buggs, I'm not missing the point. The players today are better than the player yesterday. So a lineup 1-10 is better than the lineup 1-10 yesteryear. It wouldn't matter what bats or balls are being used

not true. There are good players today, but there was just as many back then. If your a good hitter your still going to hit the ball hard, but the guy that struts around after hitting one 305(and there all over the f'en place) will soon have butthurt when the ball is caught before the warning track everytime. My league switched balls a few years ago from a 47/525 thunders to 44/375's and HR's dropped like a lead pipe. There was no more games of everyone on each team hitting hrs to maybe 8-10 in the whole league who could do it on reg basis. I haven't hit the 52's since I only play ASA and they still use 44/375s, but if it takes the advantage away from all the DB's swinging shaved bats I'm all for it. Better yet...go to 52'S and all metal.

 

[Flyman]

I get what the OP is saying... I used to love watching my Dad and Uncles play upper level ball. You never saw guys accidentally hit HR's like you do today. Especially 165lbers. They do need to adjust the ball, but they have too watch going to far. Some of these 52 balls seem to get bouncy as hell when they start lowering the core. I've noticed it a lot in league and especially with Worth balls. Infield is rough with some of these newer balls, gotta watch your grill. Also, I don't care how much the cores and compressions change because those damn Dudleys will always find their way out of a park. It's crazy how much harder those balls are and still approved.

Do you mean compression?

 

[louconn]

maybe its just where i live, but in the 10yrs or so i've played, ive never thought too many hr's were hit....

 

[#25]

All this talk about the .52/300 is making me want to try them out. I live in South Dakota, an ASA state, in league we will still be using the .44/375 this year but a complete switch to the .52/300 next year. Hearing both sides of the argument has me wanting to try them out even more.

I had one .44/300 Dudley that was mixed in with my .44/375 Dudley BP softballs. That ball flew just as far as the 375's and even out distanced some of the 375's that had bulkier seams. I think it will come down to the seams on the ball. I've hit BP with about 10 .47/375's FP balls that my buddy brought to practice and those didn't go any where. The flat seam .44/300 was easily out distancing the harder FP softballs.

My thoughts, without ever hitting the .52/300 is that the hitters will hit and the game will be brought back to a level playing field, hopefully, by eliminating the advantage of cheater bats.

 

[Bobby Buggs]

The people that think this has Anything to do with Butthurt need to just kill themselves, preferably sooner than later.
Ijs

 

[UptotheKnuckle]

The people that think this has Anything to do with Butthurt need to just kill themselves, preferably sooner than later.
Ijs

lol Some people are getting butthurt

I just always remember..

 

[nam2212]

I get what the OP is saying... I used to love watching my Dad and Uncles play upper level ball. You never saw guys accidentally hit HR's like you do today. Especially 165lbers. They do need to adjust the ball, but they have too watch going to far. Some of these 52 balls seem to get bouncy as hell when they start lowering the core. I've noticed it a lot in league and especially with Worth balls. Infield is rough with some of these newer balls, gotta watch your grill. Also, I don't care how much the cores and compressions change because those damn Dudleys will always find their way out of a park. It's crazy how much harder those balls are and still approved.

Cue Buggs talking **** about how much better Evil is than Dudley in 3....2.....

 

[moorerm04]

I have hit more out with the .52/300-275's than with .44/375's and classic m's..... I have learned to hit much better than i used too though.

 

[Bobby Buggs]

Cue Buggs talking **** about how much better Evil is than Dudley in 3....2.....

Cue, another Dbag response in 5. 4. 3.........

 

[dgambill85]

I don't mind the 5-4 games. Makes defense a priority. Now to be honest if you're only scoring 5 runs a game, your team probably sucks. Just because the homeruns are gone doesn't mean getting base hits is any harder.

 

[BIGPAPA33]

Cue Buggs talking **** about how much better Evil is than Dudley in 3....2.....

I haven't hit any of the newer evil balls over the last 4 years or so, but the old ones I do have I think there 44's...are as good as anything out there. They are beat to hell and still as hard as a rock.

 

[BIGPAPA33]

I don't mind the 5-4 games. Makes defense a priority. Now to be honest if you're only scoring 5 runs a game, your team probably sucks. Just because the homeruns are gone doesn't mean getting base hits is any harder.

Played 16in ball and every game was more than 5-4 except one, so I agree. If your team can hit it doesn't matter what balls you use or if hrs are gone.

 

[MaverickAH]

Whenever people are playing or living in their prime, they always think that time frame is the best generation. It happens in all sports, and crosses over to other things (music, movies, television, clothes).

In the 70's and early 80's, it was 36 oz bats and T-4000 softballs. The T-4000's were deemed too hot, so they were banned and replaced with balls like the super dot in .47 and .50 cor, but we also started to see in innovation in bats, with the Worth Powercell, TPS PowerDome, and Easton Redlines. Then Demarini created the doublewall and really changed how technology affected the game. Who remembers hearing the pitcher yell, "Demarini!!" to the outfielders?

Composite bats entered the game and changed it forever, in my opinion to the negative. It took the associations way too long to adjust the ball specifications, but they are finally doing so, much to the chagrin of those who have relied on composites their entire time playing softball, especially for their power.

Softball needs to come back to being not just a home run hitters game, but a game that includes base hitting as well.

Metal bats weren't intoduced until the 70's & at best, they were not better than wood bats. Their only real advantage over wood was that they didn't break & you were able to muscle some hits if you missed the 2" sweetspot. Metal bats pretty much stayed that wat until the late 80's. It wasn't until about '88 that you started to see new high tech alloys making the scene. Powercell's, Powerdomes's & the such did not appear until the early 90's. Even with the best of that lot you're talking about a singlewall with a sweetspot no bigger than 3" max. so anyone who thinks it was just about the harder balls doesn't know what they're talking about!

Even when doublewalls made their debut their main advantage was an expansion of the sweetspot to about 5.5". They didn't hit harder or farther. They just allowed you to do both more often.

I just find it more than just mildly amusing that the originator of this thread is mentioning things like hard work, skills/gifts & physical abilities while being one of the major proponents of bat doctoring! He obviously thought that people needed help back then (or at least thought that he could profit from them needing help!) but yet somehow now thinks that the help they receive from composites is bad. Ironic......

In any case, the bat/ball combo argument is a false one. The huge sweetspots of today's bats make it so. It's much easier to hit with today's bats then it was back then with the super hard balls.

 

[nam2212]

I haven't hit any of the newer evil balls over the last 4 years or so, but the old ones I do have I think there 44's...are as good as anything out there. They are beat to hell and still as hard as a rock.

I completely agree. They are on par with everything else out there. My comment was more about the constant douchebaggery out of Buggs in regards to competition.

 

[Flyman]

In any case, the bat/ball combo argument is a false one. The huge sweetspots of today's bats make it so. It's much easier to hit with today's bats then it was back then with the super hard balls.

And there you go bringing logic into an argument . Thought you would know better by now, lol.