2023 USSSA Rule Changes

TWmccoy

3DX Connoisseur
There were issues the entire conference season with bats failing either in the wrapper or passing fresh out of the wrapper on Friday afternoon and failing Saturday night when the final four got retested. I know Rip Riporti of Juno had a long conversation with Stro about this at at least one event. My understanding is that USSSA took a few bats from each manufacturer used at the Major World Series and put them through the same tests that are done on the model samples prior to approval. It's been reported that Suncoast and Juno had their bats fail those tests, i.e. if they had submitted those for approval they wouldn't have gotten a stamp. No one knows yet what the fallout from that testing will be. I don't know where the speculation that a decision would be announced today came from, I haven't heard anything but I'm pretty far removed from the people that make those decisions, at least until I get to Florida next month for CC.

I think 240 bats are simply going to have be made with thicker walls. What you're describing here is crap, and manufacturers shouldn't be allowed to make bats that fail so quickly. Most slowpitch players don't have endless budgets to be buying 10 bats a year.

IMO 240 bats should all start at about 300 and work their way down from there. Starting at 250 (or whatever) is dumb.

I don't care if USSSA drops the hammer on Juno and Suncoast. Maybe doing so will convince other manufacturers to make a better/more durable product.
 

jbo911

Super Moderator
Staff member
If they find out they sent different bats out than what they sent in for testing, that should carry a heavy penalty. There's no excuse for that, and it could even be criminal.

I don't think it's feasible, and maybe not even scientifically possible for them to say your bat must break before it drops below 240. Every bat breaks at a different number of swings, it's not the kind of thing you can manufacturer consistently.

That being said, if utrip approved a bat that tested at 250 in the wrapper that's on them. If a company makes a bar that treats at 250 niw, that's on then. If people buy a bat like that, that's on them.

The only thing I know is these bats will be popular with people that don't play with testing. If utrip doesn't start testing much more rigorously, they're going to have a huge problem on their hands. If they don't ban all bats like this, they'll have a very tough time making a legal case that they didn't intentionally look the other way if/when someone gets hurt.
 

cmo27

Local Celebrity
If they find out they sent different bats out than what they sent in for testing, that should carry a heavy penalty. There's no excuse for that, and it could even be criminal.

I don't think it's feasible, and maybe not even scientifically possible for them to say your bat must break before it drops below 240. Every bat breaks at a different number of swings, it's not the kind of thing you can manufacturer consistently.

That being said, if utrip approved a bat that tested at 250 in the wrapper that's on them. If a company makes a bar that treats at 250 niw, that's on then. If people buy a bat like that, that's on them.

The only thing I know is these bats will be popular with people that don't play with testing. If utrip doesn't start testing much more rigorously, they're going to have a huge problem on their hands. If they don't ban all bats like this, they'll have a very tough time making a legal case that they didn't intentionally look the other way if/when someone gets hurt.
Reminds me of the Easton Clarity's from 10-12 years ago that turned white-ish after they exceeded 98mph.
 

cmo27

Local Celebrity
I think 240 bats are simply going to have be made with thicker walls. What you're describing here is crap, and manufacturers shouldn't be allowed to make bats that fail so quickly. Most slowpitch players don't have endless budgets to be buying 10 bats a year.

IMO 240 bats should all start at about 300 and work their way down from there. Starting at 250 (or whatever) is dumb.

I don't care if USSSA drops the hammer on Juno and Suncoast. Maybe doing so will convince other manufacturers to make a better/more durable product.
The more they restrict performance on these 240 bats, the more they're going to entice shaving too. Just think about it, guys are still cutting hotter 220 bats because they can't hit hard enough. So anticipate another increase in that area. And with all the advances in altering with polymer, etc, they're already beating the tester.
 

EAJuggalo

Addicted to Softballfans
I don't think it's feasible, and maybe not even scientifically possible for them to say your bat must break before it drops below 240. Every bat breaks at a different number of swings, it's not the kind of thing you can manufacturer consistently.
Theoretically this is already part of the standard and has been since the 2012 stamp. Bats are required to have an indicator when they break in past 1.20 BPF.
 

jbo911

Super Moderator
Staff member
Theoretically this is already part of the standard and has been since the 2012 stamp. Bats are required to have an indicator when they break in past 1.20 BPF.
True, but they're clearly not policing it, and I don't think they really thought it through.

If the companies do it, and their bats are viewed as less desirable for it, what is their motivation to do it? What happens to the conference if Wilson and Rawlings pull their money and put it into USA?
 

EAJuggalo

Addicted to Softballfans
True, but they're clearly not policing it, and I don't think they really thought it through.

If the companies do it, and their bats are viewed as less desirable for it, what is their motivation to do it? What happens to the conference if Wilson and Rawlings pull their money and put it into USA?
Completely agree, it started off well and then no one said anything when those features were removed. What does it say about USSSA if they discover manufacturers blatantly breaking the rules and not doing anything? Especially when you just handed the Major World Series trophy to the owners of one of those companies.
Unless USA puts a lot more time and effort into developing their "Super" program, nothing. USSSA is still the dominant sanction in slow pitch at the upper levels. It would be a huge stand for one of those companies to boycott USSSA for enforcing the rules they agreed to.
 

jbo911

Super Moderator
Staff member
The thing that bothers me most about the bats is they have to understand this because of the balls. A ball is much more basic, and can still only be manufactured according to certain tolerances. I've only heard, but they say something like+/- 25 lbs within compression. That's a huge swing.

You can't manufacturer a rubber sphere to exactly 275 lbs compression, but you can make a composite bat that breaks before going below 240? I don't think so.

In addition, your reward for trying to do so is a slump in sales because the players want the hit bat if utrip is allowing them, which so far they are .
 

ilyk2win

Addicted to Softballfans
Look at the "criminal" history of one of the above mentioned owners, and the thought of shady dealings with production of bats wouldn't be so surprising to hear. I'm not saying at all that it IS happening, but knowing some past business practices makes the thought of this not so shocking. I hope it's not true though.
 

jbo911

Super Moderator
Staff member
It's worth noting, if anyone was curious, that apparently dual stamps sell worse than we'd have guessed. They still have their 220 "dual" stamps at another online retailer prices higher than their 220 utrip only bats. Anyone going to buy one bat for all is going to be pretty upset. Guess nobody has noticed to complain.
 

TWmccoy

3DX Connoisseur
It's worth noting, if anyone was curious, that apparently dual stamps sell worse than we'd have guessed. They still have their 220 "dual" stamps at another online retailer prices higher than their 220 utrip only bats. Anyone going to buy one bat for all is going to be pretty upset. Guess nobody has noticed to complain.

Dual stamp bats never really caught on. I have a couple old dual stamp Eastons. Paid $99 each for them. They aren't very good performers. I use them in cold weather.

Buying bats online is a crapshoot. You can find a bat for $99 at one website, while at another it'll be $250.
 
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