Mandatory helmets for pitchers after player dies
- Thread starter bndawgs
- Start date
AydenB00
The Rookie
So either you get my point or they're useless points, make up your mind. when someone dies it is a bad situation no matter the circumstances. explain to me how I could make it worse then that....now get off your high horse
AydenB00
The Rookie
I my point there was, that the same ball was being used as the bat evolved....well around here was , I don't know on a national level
etnstudios
Addicted to Softballfans
first off, it's a terrible tragedy and should be treated as such. my condolences to the family.
secondly, whenever the debate comes up about requiring pitcher protection, i draw my argument from the same spot that i get my motorcycle helmet argument. a lot of people feel like they shouldn't have to wear a helmet if they don't want to because it's their life and should be free to do what they want. i don't see it that way because that's an incredibly selfish way to think of things. think about all of the people you know that could be affected by your death. i also argue that the poor person who hits a motorcycle rider/was the batter in this case has to live forever with what happened and always wonder "what if they had worn a helmet." people that don't think beyond themselves or deflect/find the blame are a real problem. it sounds like their is no real fault here as it sounds like it is a freak accident, but accidents happen and planning for them can make a real difference. always gear up. any other argument can be picked apart as well but that's not the road we should go down.
thirdly, i'm rambling
secondly, whenever the debate comes up about requiring pitcher protection, i draw my argument from the same spot that i get my motorcycle helmet argument. a lot of people feel like they shouldn't have to wear a helmet if they don't want to because it's their life and should be free to do what they want. i don't see it that way because that's an incredibly selfish way to think of things. think about all of the people you know that could be affected by your death. i also argue that the poor person who hits a motorcycle rider/was the batter in this case has to live forever with what happened and always wonder "what if they had worn a helmet." people that don't think beyond themselves or deflect/find the blame are a real problem. it sounds like their is no real fault here as it sounds like it is a freak accident, but accidents happen and planning for them can make a real difference. always gear up. any other argument can be picked apart as well but that's not the road we should go down.
thirdly, i'm rambling
AydenB00
The Rookie
people need to start looking in the mirror on who is to blame. Its all a trickle down effect and there are too many hands in the cookie jar trying to make money. if the associations would say use this ball and this ball only things could change but they leave the rules to wide open, so now the local leagues will pick and choose which ball to use, then the players get all pissy if the ball sucks.
Country469
Well-Known Member
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blakcherry329
Well-Known Member
Unlimited Arc is an aberration and should be outlawed. 
I stopped playing ASA a few years ago cuz I hated trying to hit 14'+ arc pitches.
The higher the arc, the more time you have to set up and get ready. So it stands to reason that you have a better chance of making a play/protecting yourself in Unlimited and even some ASA leagues that still give you the really high arc pitches.
Most of the time I see a pitcher getting hit is when he is moving around, trying to cover a hole. My philosophy is step back and get set. I try to position the middle fielder according to the hitter, if I know them. Some might say that leaves a hole up the middle on one side or the other. I say how effective of a fielder will the pitcher be if he's moving as the ball is traveling to the plate, even if he is in the right area?
I stopped playing ASA a few years ago cuz I hated trying to hit 14'+ arc pitches.
The higher the arc, the more time you have to set up and get ready. So it stands to reason that you have a better chance of making a play/protecting yourself in Unlimited and even some ASA leagues that still give you the really high arc pitches.
Most of the time I see a pitcher getting hit is when he is moving around, trying to cover a hole. My philosophy is step back and get set. I try to position the middle fielder according to the hitter, if I know them. Some might say that leaves a hole up the middle on one side or the other. I say how effective of a fielder will the pitcher be if he's moving as the ball is traveling to the plate, even if he is in the right area?
Just to add to this, the decision to not wear a helmet affects other people's decisions as well. New and inexperienced players, kids, opponents, etc. When they see you not wearing a helmet pitching, they either think that's how the game is played or don't want to look like a wuss. They also might not be aware of the risks, like more experienced players. Making pitching masks/helments mandatory take these issues completely out of the equation, hugely mitigates the risk of head and facial injuries, and has a tiny impact on the way the game is played.
Anyone who says there are risks to everything and to move on is an idiot. Do you make your kids wear a seatbelt in your car? Do they wear a helmet riding a bike? motorcycle? hockey? football?
If mandatory pitching helmets saves 1 life, that's pretty ****ing good for such a tiny change.
tattooball
Active Member
I don't know what ball was being used but a .44 has higher speeds in the first 120 ft than a .52.
Either way this is just a horrible tragedy that should not have happened. The bad part is bats are to hot.
Either way this is just a horrible tragedy that should not have happened. The bad part is bats are to hot.
Country469
Well-Known Member
classic M kevin
TWmccoy
3DX Connoisseur
This I agree with. I think there should be a minimum weight bats can be... and it shouldn't be below 28 oz. Look at what NCAA baseball did with BBCOR bats. -3 length to weight ratio. The bats are FAR deader in college baseball now than they used to be. Softball needs something very similar to happen.
I'm sure the guy who hit him feels the same way.
stork
Rocky Mountain Oyster aka DirtDog
I never skied with a helmet until a few years ago when the wife got one for me and asking, not demanding I wear it. Took a little getting used to but now I don't even notice it really. Last year a less experienced friend checked his speed right into my line and had a bad collision and landed on my head and got a concussion even with the helmet. It would have been much much worse if I didn't have it.
Point is, we can feel really confident that we are in control and can handle a situation and damn it if we make a mistake, we'll take it like a man. You know what? **** that. It's easy to say before it happens, or with a near miss. But if something bad does happen, you might really regret not putting your pride aside and protecting yourself. Life is full of curveballs(pun?), and you never know when it is coming your way.
It's your life, your journey, so do what you will. This is your one trip unless you believe in more. Whatever.
Point is, we can feel really confident that we are in control and can handle a situation and damn it if we make a mistake, we'll take it like a man. You know what? **** that. It's easy to say before it happens, or with a near miss. But if something bad does happen, you might really regret not putting your pride aside and protecting yourself. Life is full of curveballs(pun?), and you never know when it is coming your way.
It's your life, your journey, so do what you will. This is your one trip unless you believe in more. Whatever.
SammyJaxxx
Starting Player
I play in a wood bat league, an aluminum bat league and ASA approved composite league. I don't pitch in the wood bat league because it is modified but I do play first and third. I pitch in the Aluminum and Composite leagues.
I don't have any scientific proof, but the difference in reaction time is exponential. Also the severity of the bruises from catching one off the leg is much worse with a composite.
If the associations have any concern for safety they need to dial back how hot these bats are. If LDs are concerned about safety they need to tests bats regularly not just at the start of the season.
I would also advocate for raising the arc to 15 feet.
I don't have any scientific proof, but the difference in reaction time is exponential. Also the severity of the bruises from catching one off the leg is much worse with a composite.
If the associations have any concern for safety they need to dial back how hot these bats are. If LDs are concerned about safety they need to tests bats regularly not just at the start of the season.
I would also advocate for raising the arc to 15 feet.
coming from a guy who has been banned for commenting about another board members deceased mother.........
Hiltz
Built for comfort
He's the one with the deceased mother (sorry Josh), he got banned for "trolling" Monsta Carl.
hacker72
Addicted to Softballfans
Well this thread went as about expected.. lol. All I can say, that if this tragedy keeps someone else from getting injured or causes someone else to lose their life, is it worth it. As I sit here on Christmas, knowing he will not be, his WIDOW beside herself kind of gets me in the feels. His background was he played ball all his life, played college ball (starter) and all. Played at a high level with exceptional hands AND if this could happen to him, it could happen to anyone. The game is just that A GAME..... I'm not trying to alter someones life by playing it. It has altered many lives as it is. Many associations are making adjustments (offering a screen or a helmet) to pitchers which in my opinion is great.
Play hard, be safe and enjoy the game!!
May you ALL have a Merry Christmas and may Greg R.I.P.
Play hard, be safe and enjoy the game!!
May you ALL have a Merry Christmas and may Greg R.I.P.
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jhitman
Well-Known Member
Well said and my deepest sympathies for the loss of your friend.
daddyfrank
Addicted to Softballfans
That wasn’t the case here. Greg was a very experienced player. Great glove, quick hands, played SS, middle infielder and pitcher. In my 12 years of playing tournaments I’m pretty sure I saw him at every one and he played in multiple leagues as well. As Hacker stated earlier Greg pitched the ball, dropped back to cover the hole and the ball deflected off his glove. It’s a freak accident and a tragedy and my prayers go out to his wife and family.
ddoubler
Addicted to Softballfans
This has to be the dumbest reply back to one of the most logical statements in this thread . You’re asking for data on something that is proven by physics? That’s like saying if you get closer to a raging fire that you still need proof that it gets hotter. Unreal dude ... the further back you get the more time you have to react. How you need data for this is truly dumbfounding
AydenB00
The Rookie
and this has to be the absolute dumbest reply to a reply, no **** Sherlock on there would be more movement the further you move back....the data I would be looking for, would be how much movement can you make. I mean it would take a little common sense on your part to think that would be the data someone would be looking for.... just think it about for a minute
dunkky
Well-Known Member
well.. i might have some data.. If i am wrong, then, math dude can correct it.
90 mph = 475200 ft
ball travels 132 ft per sec.
distance from a mound to home is about 50 ft(not sure on this one, seems to vary)
according to a brain surgeon above, it registers our brain when ball is about the half way which is 25 ft.
so, 25/132 = 0.189 sec. so you have 0.189 sec to react and save your face.
now if you take a few steps back, which i think is about ~5ft (assumption made based on what i saw from major league pitchers from youtube)
that give us extra 5 ft, so 30/132 = 0.227 sec to react and save your pretty face.
0.227 - 0.189 = 0.038 sec. you gained 0.038 sec by moving a few steps back.
0.038 sec is ~20% of 0.189 sec.
that number is significant enough i think. it gives you extra 20% more sec to save your life.
i kinda did some stupid thing trying to see how fast i can raise my arm from my chest to my face.. I didn't measure but it takes about 0.2 sec or even less from my observation.
remember, every inch counts here where the ball will hit you. within an inch difference you are looking at no injury - light injury - serious injury - death.
so, from practical point of view, is it worth?, answer is HELL yes. Remember, it's not just fast ball, even 50mph can kill you when it hits right spot. not everyone has same reaction time, some are more athletic than others. that case, slower the ball, more reaction time you gain, so, it is no brainer to take a few steps back.
90 mph = 475200 ft
ball travels 132 ft per sec.
distance from a mound to home is about 50 ft(not sure on this one, seems to vary)
according to a brain surgeon above, it registers our brain when ball is about the half way which is 25 ft.
so, 25/132 = 0.189 sec. so you have 0.189 sec to react and save your face.
now if you take a few steps back, which i think is about ~5ft (assumption made based on what i saw from major league pitchers from youtube)
that give us extra 5 ft, so 30/132 = 0.227 sec to react and save your pretty face.
0.227 - 0.189 = 0.038 sec. you gained 0.038 sec by moving a few steps back.
0.038 sec is ~20% of 0.189 sec.
that number is significant enough i think. it gives you extra 20% more sec to save your life.
i kinda did some stupid thing trying to see how fast i can raise my arm from my chest to my face.. I didn't measure but it takes about 0.2 sec or even less from my observation.
remember, every inch counts here where the ball will hit you. within an inch difference you are looking at no injury - light injury - serious injury - death.
so, from practical point of view, is it worth?, answer is HELL yes. Remember, it's not just fast ball, even 50mph can kill you when it hits right spot. not everyone has same reaction time, some are more athletic than others. that case, slower the ball, more reaction time you gain, so, it is no brainer to take a few steps back.
When people make a bat that's not for ASA, they just don't put an ASA stamp on it. Back in the day they were banning previously legal ASA bats so they had to keep a list. It became pointless when people realized they were making a ton of bats without the stamp.
FlashTheLeather
Addicted to Softballfans
Well said Bill. I didn't bother to go through the middle 4 pages of this thread after I saw the direction it was going in. I can't say I was close with Fusco as I wasn't, but I couldn't even tell you how many league and tournament games I played against him. Stand up dude with a very solid glove. Couldn't believe the news when I first read he was in a coma, really couldn't believe it when I heard he passed. Horrible situation for everyone and it probably couldn't have happened to someone that loved the game more than Greg.
melkyway11
New Member
So sorry man